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April 13th, 2008


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Bahrain: Policeman's death divides bloggers 

a small portrait of this author Ayesha Saldanha · 23:54
lingua → mg · es

Earlier this week a Bahraini policeman, Majid Asghar Ali, 27, was killed after a patrol car was attacked and set on fire near a village called Karzakan. Bahrain's bloggers have been quick to comment.

SoulSearch is in shock:

What happened last night? What provoked a gang of 30 to 40 hooligans to do what they did last night? What's happening to Bahrain? When folks just want to get a good night's sleep to be able to go to work the next day and earn an honest living?
Does violence solve anything?
Majid Asghar Ali from the Police Force is dead. And for what? Does this help Bahrain in any way? Does this violence serve any cause?
It was a total shock to read the papers this morning. I almost choked on my coffee and sandwich!
God help us. Where are we going?
Peace people. You don't want to turn into another Lebanon. Trust me.
Peace for Bahrain.

So is Naz:

I am angry. Angry, shocked, Stunned that any kind of person find this kind of behaviour acceptable, or even worse, justifiable!
What is wrong with people?
Now I consider myself quite politically illiterate, and I’m happy to admit it, but surely there are better ways to make a point than throwing tantrums like 6 year olds? ways other than burning, hurting, sabotaging? better than violence?
Is it just me that wants home to remain home? To be able to see a happy future for my country and countrymen (and women)?

Butterfly remembers the death of a demonstrator, Ali Jassim Makki, in December, and blames both deaths on sectarianism:

اليوم ماجد أصغر علي وبالأمس علي جاسم مكي.
وكل ما يعني البعض هو اختلاق الذرائع وتوزيع الاتهامات .. اما بالنسبة لهم فلم يعد مهما من يدين من ومن يلصق التهمة بمن .. لم يعد مهما ان يشحذ بعضهم الهمم لإثبات ان كان الضحية خائن أم شهيد آخر من شهداء الوطن.
فهؤلاء من فقدوا ابنائهم بين ليلة وضحاها بسبب ذنب لم يقترفوه ولم يقترفه صغارهم هم من أصبحوا ثكلى وأرامل ويتامى .. هؤلاء من سيحتفظون بسرادق العزاء في ذاكرتهم لا لثلاثة أيام ولا لأسبوع بل الدهر كله .. هؤلاء هم من يدفعون ثمن جرائمكم .. طائفيتكم واحقادكم .. طائفية عنصرية تفرق حتى في الموت بين نفس ونفس وفقا لجنسيتها وعقيدتها!
Today it was Majed Asghar Ali and yesterday Ali Jassim Maki. And all that some are concerned with is making up excuses and hurling accusations. For those people, it is not important who to condemn and who accuses whom… It is not important for them to prove whether the victim was a traitor or another martyr of this nation. It is those who have lost one of their sons, between a nightfall and its dawn, because of a fault which they and their children did not commit, who will wake up to be distraught, widows and orphans. It is those who will save the details of the mourning gatherings, not for three days or a week - but for eternity. It is those who pay the price for your crimes, your sectarianism and your envy.. A racist sectarianism which distinguishes between souls even in death, categorising people according to their nationalities and sects.

Manama Republic compares the lives of the demonstrators in Karzakan to the policeman, who came originally from Balochistan:

أولئك الفتية ولدوا في مثل السنة التي ولد ماجد فيها، وذهبوا إلى مثل المدرسة الثانوية التي ذهب إليها. ولكنهم لم يسمح لهم يوما، حتى في أحلام يقظتهم، بأن يجدوا في الخدمة العسكرية والبزة العسكرية وحمل السلاح، إشباعا كافيا، ماديا أو معنويا. كان لماجد الذي ولد في بلوشستان شرف إرتداء زي القوة الخاصة. ولم يكن لأي من الذين ولدوا في كرزكان إلا إرتداء الصدر العاري والمولوتوف. ولم يكن زيهم هذا مختارا.
Those young men were born in the same year Majid was born in and went to a secondary school, similar to the one he went to. But they weren't allowed, even while they were day dreaming, to serve in the military, don the military costume or even carry arms, physically or even morally. The honour of wearing the Special Forces uniform was for Majid, who was born in Balochistan. For those born in Karzakan, they had to do with the bare chests and the Molotovs - which wasn't by choice.

However, not all Bahrainis are convinced by the official story of Majid Asghar Ali's death. Ebtihal Salman has her doubts:

…لا أحد يمكن أن يشهد على هذا القتل ويؤكد وجود الجثة بل ويؤكد انها لجندي كان متواجداً في مكان الحادث، لا أحد يشهد للعروسة غير أمها (وزارة الداخلية). قبل أن نندفع لمناقشة الأسباب والنتائج والمواقف.. من يؤكد حصول هذا القتل أصلاً؟
No one has witnessed this murder and can ascertain its presence and that it was for a soldier, who was at the scene of the accident. No one has anything to say about the bride, except her mother (The Ministry of Interior). Before we get carried away discussing the reasons, consequences and stances.. who can prove that this murder took place to begin with?

Haythoo, a political activist, also expresses his disbelief at the government's story:

مـسرحية جديدة من وزارة الـداخلية, لـجر الساحة البحرينية لـحرب أهلية, و إعتقال المزيد من الناشطين! … ما معنى أن تكون السيارة تحترق لوحدها و فردين من المخابرات واقفان و يطلقان الـنار؟ لماذا لم يصابا بأذى, و كيف لما يقومان بإنقاذ صديقهما؟
This is a new theatrical production by the Ministry of Interior to drag Bahrainis into a civil war and to justify further arrests of activists! What does it mean then that a vehicle burns on its own and two informants standing nearby, firing shots? And why weren't they hurt and how come did they not rescue their friend?

And in another post he says:

…لا أعتقد إن الشاب قد قتل في موقع الحادثة! لـيس هدفنا الـقتل, و لـيس من عاداتنا الـقتل, و لا نـريد لـدم أن يـسفك.. نريد حقوقنا لا أكثر.
I don't believe that this young man was killed at the scene of this incident! Murder is not our goal nor is it part of our traditions. We don't want to spill blood.. all we want is our rights .. nothing more.

But Mahmood is fed up of the conspiracy theorists:

Who benefits from violence? … And the thing that beggars belief is that we find people condoning this activity or are in complete and utter denial. Putting “their side” on a pedestal and who can do no wrong whatsoever; while on the other hand, they blame the government for all ills without recognising a single positive aspect of its creation. Yes, we do have problems, but the line must be drawn in our own psyche to ensure that we actually do recognise wrong when we see it, regardless of who perpetrates it. And we should also drop those continuous conspiracy theories which some use to justify wrongs. In this particular instance; can anyone come up with a valid scenario in which we see elements in our government would actually sponsor people to throw Molotov cocktails on their own occupied police vehicles and sacrifice a human life while putting others in jeopardy simply to score a point? What insanity is this? […] Enough is enough. On both sides. We want to live with a semblance of harmony for goodness’ sake. These vandalism and criminal acts are not helping one little bit. Everybody, even who are called the opposition should come out and unambiguously condemn these criminal acts.

2 comments · »»

Blogger of the Week: Victor Kaonga 

a small portrait of this author Amira Al Hussaini · 19:36
lingua → es
sample image for this post

Victor Kaonga 2

Today's Blogger of the Week series takes us to the heart of Africa, where we catch up with our Malawian blogger Victor Kaonga, who talks to us about his journey with blogging, the media and technology scene in Malawi and his special relationship with God.

A radio journalist, 35-year-old Victor, who blogs in English, is currently working towards obtaining a Masters degree in Global Journalism, from Orebro University, Sweden, which he hopes to complete by the summer. Once back home, he aims to coach his colleagues, where together they will embark on a fascinating journey of learning how to communicate with people and the world at large, using modern technology, in a country which had its first television station opened in 1999.

Following is our interview with Victor, who left his home in August 2006, started blogging the following month and joined Global Voices Online in January 2007 to amplify the “untold stories of Malawi to the global community.”

When did you start blogging and why?

In September 2006. I was looking forward to blogging having heard about it the year before at a Highway Conference in South Africa. At that time, I did not know how until I came to Sweden for the course, when one of the former course mates taught us about blogging and how to do it.
I have been blogging for several reasons: One to share information about and on Malawi. I thought I am a privileged person being a journalist in Malawi who can say something on the Internet especially through blogs. Two, I really wanted to tell my own stories in a way that I had never thought of before hoping to expand my social networks. Three, I just wanted to grow and learn more about this Information Highway by ‘being in it.' Fourthly, I come from a background where I have always admired participating in global issues and I thought the blogosphere was the perfect place for me to start from.

Being a career journalist, how different is blogging from journalism?

I have lots of freedom to express myself, put things into both global and personal perspective in ways I cannot in a normal media outlet. Blogging gives me space also to mix text, images and sounds sometimes, which is not possible in radio alone where I am used and where I started working in August 1999. In my career as a journalist, I have mostly been in broadcasting hence blogging is a way of making putting words into sentences on ‘paper.' Otherwise, I am mostly a voice person.

How many languages do you speak?

I speak four fluently and can use them all on air also and I am able to hear a few others, which I cannot speak.
I am fluent in English, Tumbuka, Lambya and Chichewa - the last three are all Malawian languages spoken also in parts of Zambia and Tanzania.

How many Malawian bloggers are there? And do they all blog in English?

There are about 60 known to me and all of them blog in English except for two, who blog in Chichewa and Lambya.

Amazing! Why is that? Are they all in Malawi or abroad?

Many bloggers find it tough to blog in their mother tongue as we have grown up using English for instruction in school - but I also think that many have not been that patriotic!! We tend to look down on our own languages but that seems to be changing now. Our political background also has had some influence in Malawi. We were taught that an educated speaks or writes in English. For now, I would say that most of the bloggers are in the diaspora, where it is much easier as they have better Internet access and a few are in Malawi - with not so regular access but one I would describe as considerable access! The ones blogging in Malawi mostly access Internet at places of work or cafes as extremely few people ever access Internet from their homes. In fact, the number is almost negligible.

Do blogs have a big following of readers?

By readers in the diaspora, yes, but not at home, due to limited access to the Internet as as well as lack of awareness. Many people who have the potential do not know what blogs are but my personal observation is that the number of readers and bloggers is picking up now.

Do you expect that to change soon?

Already it is changing I think, as there is growing Internet access according to people that work with ISPs in Malawi. There is also a popular Malawian online paper, which once in a while features stories from Malawis blogs.

What are the main issues effecting your blogosphere?

There is a whole range largely on politics especially the elections coming up in 2009. We also have lifestyle issues, and a mixture on socio-economic challenges. On a few occasions we have Information and Communications Technology (ICT) stories.

How would you like to see the Internet and blogging utilised in Malawi? Would you like to see bloggers spread say health awareness? Or be an outlet for news mainstream media doesn't cover?

Mostly, it would be important if blogging could be used as lobby tool. If several bloggers make noise, the authorities wake up and respond. The issue is that the authorities in Malawi (in my view) are scared of many things published online. As such, if there is some pressure on them on a particular issue, they tend to respond and attend to the problem at hand. So the blogging can be on anything of concern to Malawi and it will work as long as the bloggers are consistent and write with facts.

Is the media in Malawi free? Do you have censorship issues?

There is considerable amount of freedom in Malawi. Censorship is there but I would say mostly, it is self-censorship, having come from a background of 30 years of dictatorial rule until 1994. But the biggest challenge in my view in Malawi is political influence on and in the media and not necessarily censorship per se. There is both public and private media and I think private media is doing a very commendable job.

Victor, you have a foot in both worlds. One is Radio - which reaches to people and doesn't need technology and the other is really hi-tech considering that not many people even know what blogs are. Which one is more gratifying for you as a journalist and why?

Interesting question! Radio is more gratifying to me for many reasons. With radio, I am able to impact or reach more people. In Malawi, radio is still the main mass medium, contributing about 70 per cent of the media. Ambition wise I wanted to be on radio right from I was eight, in primary school! Having said this, I enjoy writing and find it fulfilling as it gives me a written record that I can turn to later on. But also writing is enriching me as I hear or get feedback from those who have read the posts. So indeed I am between two worlds but I believe I serve two ‘audiences.' I have learnt that if you have an idea, share it in writing, and not just on radio alone! So now with blogging, I have that opportunity to balance those interests and audiences.

Why did you only work for radio then? Why not TV or newspapers?

When I was in primary school, I only knew of radio, no newspaper - of course there was one but dad never bought it. And there was no TV. Television only came to Malawi in 1999. And I am that kind of person who grew up in a very rural area where all we had was radio to connect us to the world.

You come from a country where there are people who are suffering from famine - and with the high incidence of AIDS - can you envision a way to use technology, specifically online tools, to help them?

Yes. I have always thought that such people in any situation can share their experiences, diarise them and share what keeps them on or what inspires them. In fact I have mentioned to several people to jot down and share their life stories, in a kind of a online journal and as long as it is a personal story, someone will find it exciting. So people going through any problems of health, such as with AIDS in Malawi, market vendors in town, small entrepreneurs and young girls cantell their stories online but I know the challenge for most of them is knowledge and fear of the Internet!

Fear of the Internet?

To begin with some people feel challenged by the computer. So when you start talking about writing something for online consumption, you are scaring them further and that is why some people fear the Internet. We have very few people who are well exposed to the ICTs. Of course, there is a lot of interest but this is only by younger people but not those categories whom you would want to target immediately. We have majority of secondary schools that do not computers at all.

So when are graduates first exposed to computers and the Internet? And who has access to them?

These days the computers are becoming more available but still limited to the urban schools. Most secondary students before say 1990 saw computers at the university or in colleges only.

So they saw computers before TV?

Yes, that was the case in Malawi. People saw computers before TV. We could hear of TV in neighbouring Zambia and Tanzania but not in Malawi itself. Of course there were video screens but then they could just are movies and those who had screens were elites! Also note that I think our society is an oral one mostly. So some people are not keen to write down things.

How are people taking on to TV? Was it seen as a positive development? And do you only have a state channel or are there now private stations?

We only have one state channel. There was attempt for a private one but it was suspended, so I am told. Otherwise, people welcomed it only to be disappointed by politicians who are using it for their ends. But being the only TV station, many people are glued to it and are proud to watch a relative, friend or Victor in the box.

What did you cover when you were a radio journalist?

A whole range issues, mostly Christian lifestyle, since I work with a gospel radio station but my work has also been around youth issues and news and then the last four years, I have spent relatively more time in managing the programming and developing programmes and projects.

What do you hope to achieve when you return with your degree home?

When I return, I want to mostly be available for coaching as I think that is most of our work lies. We have a wonderful team in Malawi of media people there and normally they admire those with further qualifications, so coaching in general programming yes, but also I want to spend time help out in ICTs coverage as well if possible mobilise ourselves for internet journalism. By that I mean to promote use of the Internet for journalism in which case blogging too.. We have a tremendous lack of even basic skills in Malawi, among journalists especially.

What are your hopes for Malawi and its people?

I am just hoping that Malawians would have better health systems and facilities and then they can grow into knowing about the world as well as contribute to global conversations.

Talk to me about your family, whom I understand are back home in Malawi? What are your hopes for them?

I have three daughters. My first born is Nayumo, who is almost six, my second is Sayiwe, four, and the third is Angana, who is 18 months old. All these names are in my mother tongue Lambya. I hope that they grow into women who fear God, and are responsible. Most of all that they will respect their mother Thembi at all times. I miss them as I am way from home Malawi. But I look forward to returning to them this June.

My most memorable blogging experience also revolves around my family. On Valentine's Day, I wrote about how I met my wife. I was scared to blog about it yet I wanted to. This was the second Valentine's Day I was far away from my wife so I really wanted to do something special for her. The best I thought was to write about her and tell the ‘world'. I got and still do get comments from people. Some younger ladies laugh and are thankful I shared the story. They say they have learnt one or two things. Younger men have said they are encouraged theirs is on the way…..

And what is your relationship with God?

I grew up in a family where parents were Christians and all of us as children were taught to obey and fear God. In secondary school I made a personal decision to be a Christian much as I had grown up with that background. I was encouraged by many Christians I met in Secondary school to be a committed Christian. The same encouragement was available at the University of Malawi -the only one then and then finally in 1998 I joined campus organisation where were worked amongst university students. Then in 1999 I started working with a Christian organisation where I still belong to date - Trans World Radio. Something worth mentioning is that I am one of the 11 children in our family! But our parents encouraged us to fear God. Of course we have failed many times but ….whenever we failed, God picked us up.

Being a Malawian abroad, what are the stereotypes you face? Do people you come across know about your country?

Many many say they have never heard about Malawi, some ask if it is in Sudan or South Africa. It can also be implied that some people think I am an asylum seeker. I can tell this from their statements or actions, basically those are the main ones. Otherwise, I find lots of nice people and I have had to learn to adjust.

As a media person, do you feel you have a role to play to spread more awareness about Malawi and its people?

Part of my adjusting is based on the fact I am a journalist who has a role to inform them about my country and myself. I also take myself as diplomat. As much as I can, I feel that as a journalist, I am duty bound to share information about Malawi. I would live like a Malawian if they can allow me. And that makes me a very happy person.

Thank you Victor for your time and insights!

Zikomo, Ndagha (thanks)

7 comments · »»

Korea: Another Election and Disputes between those in their 20s and 30-40s. 

a small portrait of this author Hyejin Kim · 14:14

The general election took place on the 9th of April. The result the absolute victory for the conservative party, the GNP that the current President Lee Myung Bak belongs to. While the majority expected the opposite result because of the continual disputes against policies of the current President, the result generates shocks to some people. Many major politicians of other parties lost and politicians who were confident of winning drank bitter cups. After the analysis of the voting was publicized, the fact that those in their twenties chose the conservative party regardless of demonstrations against the current government due to the increase of college tuition fee (post, 2nd of April) lead several netizens to analyze the reason and to have discussions.
Photohistory analyzes why those in their 20s are conservative.

20대 그들이 보수화된 이유
20대들이 욕을 먹고 있네요. 어제 총선을 지켜보면서 가장 충격적이었던 일이 바로 20대의 저조한 투표율보다 더 놀랐던것은 20대들이 50,60대와 맞먹는 수치의 보수정당(사실은 수구정당임)인 한나라당을 지지하는 것이었습니다. 지난달 말 등록금 인상반대 시위를 하던 3천명정도의 대학생들이 외치던 땡박이 맹박이를 죽일놈이라고 외치던 모습이 무색할정도 였습니다. 지난해 연말의 대선전에 40여개의 대학교 총학생회가 이명박지지선언을 한것을 부끄럽게 여기고 이번 총선에는 좀 달라지겠구나 했습니다. 그러나 결과는 별로 다르지 않다는것입니다. 20대의 20대 초반의 나이에 있는 젊은이의 80%가 대학생임을 감안하면 대부분이 대학생일텐데 모여서는 이명박대통령 욕하면서 현실적으로 현정부에 대한 비판의사를 표출할수 있는 선거에서는 거꾸로 지지하는 모습은 뭘로 설명할수 있을까요?

어제 뉴스앵커가 20대의 보수화에 대해서 이걸 어떻게 설명해야 할까 하는 곤혹스러운 모습까지 살짝 비치던데요. 왜 이럴까요? 젊은이=진보 라는 공식은 전세계의 공통적인 모습입니다.
젊은사람들은 가진것이 없기에 기득권층을 향한 비판을 하며 패기와 열정으로 사회를 개혁하고자 하는 모습은 진보의 모습으로 표출되곤합니다. 왜 그런걸까요?

뭐 30대나 40대도 수치만 낮지 보수정당인 한나라당을 1등으로 지지하기는 했습니다… 제 나름대로 분석해 보겠습니다.

The reason why those in their 20s are conservative.

Those in their 20s are criticized. Looking at the general election yesterday, the most shocking thing I had was that they supported the conservative party (extremely conservative party honestly speaking), the Grand National Party, as much as those in their 50s and 60s did rather than the low ratio of voting from those in their 20s. Last month, 3,000 college students blamed the current president harshly while they had the demonstrations against the increase of the tuition fee. What about that? Last year, student presidents of 40 colleges who supported Lee Myung Bak in the Presidential Election expressed their shame. Therefore, I thought the general election would be different. But the result was not different. Let’s say that 80 percent of the early 20s are college students. They get together and criticize the President, but in reality they rather support him in the election when they can express their opinions. How can we explain this?

Yesterday, a news anchorman even showed puzzlement over how to explain the conservation of those in their 20s. Why? The youth=progress… this formula is the common characteristic of the world. The young people don’t have things yet. Therefore, they criticize against the vested. What they try to reform with passion and ambition is regarded as progress.
Those in their 30s and 40s have a lower ratio, but they also supported the conservative party more than other parties. I tried to analyze in my way.

1. 정치에 관심이 없다.

저의 20대때도 정치에 관심이 없었습니다. 모여서 하는 이야기중에 정치이야기는 없었습니다.
정치 이야기를 하기에는 할 이야기들이 많았습니다. 또한 정치가 피부에 와 닿지 않았습니다.
다만 뉴스에서 연일 쏟아지는 5,18청문회, 전두환, 노태우 전대통령이 수의입고 법정에 서있던 모습을 보았습니다. 그래서 민자당=개새끼라는것은 알았습니다. 그래서 선거때는 민자당의 다른이름인 신한국당을 지지하지 않았습니다. 그러다 신한국당이 한나라당으로 이름을 바꾸고 첫번째 이룩한일이 바로 IMF였습니다. 정치에 관심이 없어도 선거 안할수가 없더군요.
정치인을 잘못뽑으니 이런 결과가 나오는구나 한탄을 하면서요. 일어나자마자 선거했던 기억이 나네요.

그러나 지금의 20대들은 정치가 피부에 와 닿는게 없습니다. 20대중에 자기가 돈 벌어서 자기가 등록금 내는 사람이 몇명이나 있을까요? 20대 직장인중에 월급에서 알아서 빠져나가는 각종 세금말고 국가에 세금내는 것이 뭐가 있을까요? 저도 20대때는 정치보단 다른일에 관심이 많았습니다. 친구들과 모여서 히히덕거리기 바뻤구 가끔 정치이야기를 꺼내면 친구들이 손사래를 치면서 피하더군요. 정치이야기=고리타분 공식이 있는것 같더군요.

그런데 요즘은 친구들 모임에서 정치이야기가 떠나질 않는 군요. 왜 달라졌을까요? 친구들이 애낳고 애길러보면서 세상을 보니 온통 정치인들이 만들어 놓은 세상이었습니다. 뭘해도 세금을 내라고 하고 사회 시스템을 보게 되기 시작합니다. 한가족의 가장이 되면 정치인들이 만들어 놓은 세상이 보이기 시작합니다. 하다못해 기름값 올리고 내리는모습을 보면서도 정치인들에게 욕을합니다.

1. No interest in politics

I was not interested in politics in my 20s. My friends and I never talked about politics. Rather than talking about it, we have so many other things to talk about. In addition, those topics didn’t affect me so much. What I was familiar with was the scenes of the 5 18 Hearing and of the court that the previous presidents Jeon Doo Hwan and Roh Tae Woo were wearing shrouds. So I knew that the Minjadang is equal to shit. In the presidential election, I didn’t support the Shinhankookdang that was changed from the Minjadang. And then what the Grand National Party accomplished after they changed the name from Shinhankookdang was IMF. Even though I was not interested in politics, I could not help but participate in the election. I knew that selecting wrong politicians would end up with this kind of result. As soon as I woke up, I went to the voting place.

But those in their 20s at present are not interested in politics. How many of them are paying tuition fee with their own money? How many employees in their 20s pay taxes to the country except those that get it automatically deducted from their salaries? When I was in my 20s, I was interested in other matters than politics. Gathering together with friends, I was busy talking about other topics. Sometimes, when I started talking about politics, friends stopped me, because politics are equal to boring.

But recently our major topic of conversations is politics. Why did it change like that? We have babies and raise them… and observing this world…. This world is made by politicians. Whatever we do, we have to pay tax… and then we look at the society system. If you are the breadwinner of a family, you can see the world that politicians made. Looking at the capricious oil price, we criticize politicians.

2. 정치에 관심이 있어도 한나라당을 지지한다.

한나라당의 전신은 민자당 민자당의 전신은 민정당입니다. 민정당은 5,18 광주민주항쟁을 일으킨 전두환이란 작자가 수장으로 있던 당입니다. 그런데 20대중에 그런것을 인지하는 사람은 몇이나 있을까요. 인지하고 있어도 그게뭐 어때서~~ 어쩌라구. 그래서 뭐~~ 라고 하는 사람도 많습니다. 20대들은 술자리에서 세상을 원망합니다. 자기들이 백수로 있는 이유는 첫째가 정부때문이라고 합니다. 물론 정부도 잘한것은 없지만 지금같이 공급과잉되는 대학생들은 구조적으로 백수를 생산할수 밖에 없습니다. 또한 비정규직으로 내몰리는 대부분의 대학생들은 그 비정규직법을 만든 민주당을 손가락질하고 돌팔매질합니다. 그리고 한나라당을 대안으로 삼습니다. 그러나 그 비정규직법을 통과시킨것은 민주당 혼자한게 아닙니다. 한나라당의 적극적 도움이 아니였다면 통과하기 힘들겠죠. 여기서 알수 있듯이 대학생들이 깊이있는 사유와 사고를 하지 않습니다.

그냥 정권만 바꾸면 자기들 취직문제가 해결될줄 아는 사람들이 대부분입니다. 정치에 관심없다보니 정치돌아가는것에 어설프게 알고 있는것도 있을것입니다. 모르는것보다 더 무서운게 어설프게 알고 있는것이라고 하던데 그런모습이 있지 않을까 합니다. 지난 대선전에 40개의 대학교 총학들이 지지선언을 하는것을 보고 충격을 먹었습니다. 지지못할것은 없지만 부자정당 기득권정당 1%정당 그리고 도덕적으로 흠이 그렇게 많은 대통령을 지지하는 모습을 보면서 정말 놀랬습니다. 20대도 세상의 우선가치가 먹고사는것인가 하는 생각이 들더군요.

20대를 너무 비판하는것 같기도 하네요. 하지만 아실거예요. 20대중에 나 이러이러해서 한나라당 지지한다, 라고 자신있게 외치는 사람은 없습니다. 혹시 이 글을 읽는 20대중 한나라당을 지지하는 이유를 적어주시고 제 견해가 잘못되었다고 지적해주셨으면 합니다.

2. Even though they’re interested in politics, they still support the Grand National Party(GNP).

Previous names of the GNP were the Manjadang and Minjeongdang. The Minjeongdang was established by Jeon Doo Hwan who caused the 5.18 Kwangju tragedy. How many young people know about it? Although they know, they might say, ‘so?’ and ‘so what?’ They blame this world. The reason why they live as unemployees is due to the government. Of course, the government didn’t do any good. But when we have so many college students, the society can’t but help to have unemployees. In addition, college students who work as irregular employees harshly criticize the Minjudang, which make the irregular employee law. And they take the GNP as the substitute. But the reason why the law was passed was not by the Minjudang itself. It was impossible to pass if there was no active support from the GNP. As we can see from here, college students don’t have deep thought.

They simply think that their problems to find jobs will be solved if the government changes. They’re not interested in politics and therefore they roughly know about politics. Knowing roughly rather than knowing nothing is more dangerous. The current situation is like that. When I saw 40 college student presidents announced their support for the GNP, I was shocked. Of course, they don’t have to be against them. But it was surprising to see they support the person who morally has problems and the party, the rich party and 1 percent party. It seems that to those in their 20s, how to eat and live is the priority of their life value.

It seems that I criticize those in their 20s way too much. But everyone will know. I haven’t seen anyone who confidently says why they support the GNP. If some of you can say that there is a reason why you support the GNP and my opinion is wrong, please criticize me.

3. 세상 돌아가는 것보단 자신에게 당장 당근을 준다는 곳으로 달려간다

세상돌아가는 이치를 20대는 모릅니다. 손에는 영어관련 책이 들려있구 학원으로 도서실로 공부만 하는게 20대 입니다. 예전처럼 사회참여를 적극적으로 하여 사회를 개혁하는 모습은 극소수입니다. 자기개발에 투자하는게 현명하다고 판단하여 동아리도 가입하지 않습니다. 개인주의가 점점 더 팽배해지고 어울림을 잘 모릅니다. 자격증 하나 더 따고 토익점수 올리기 바쁘고 그래야 회사에 취직하기 쉽기 때문입니다. 사회비판세력이 되기보단 사회가 만들어놓은 세상에 잘적응하기 위해 순응주의형 인간들이 대부분입니다. 앞에서는 정부를 질타하면서 정작 행동으로 보여주지 않고 그냥 술자리에서 한숨소리에 섞여 욕만하는게 최고의 비판입니다. 그리고 등록금 반값으로 내려주겠다. 일자리 많이 만들어주겠다고 하는 한나라당으로 달려갑니다. 그러나 등록금 반값 공약한 한나라당 대통령은 지금 등록금에 관심없습니다.
뒤통수를 맞은거죠. 그런데 또 총선에서도 한나라당을 지지합니다. 민주당에서 해답을 내놓지 않으니 대안으로 한나라등을 지지하는 모습이 다분히 많은듯 합니다.

요즘 20대들을 보면 건강해 보이기는 하는데 영혼은 허약해 보입니다. 그들이 누굴 지지하는지는 그들의 선택이니 크게 뭐라고 하지는 않겠습니다.(위에 심하게 지적했다면 이해해 주십시요) 하지만 20대들과 대화를 해보면 얘들같다는 생각이 들때가 정말 많습니다. 부모님에게는 50살 먹은 자식도 아이로 보인다고 하는데 저도 그런것인지는 모르겠습니다. 인문학에 대한 교양은 거의 없고 전공지식만 달달외운모습만 보이고 자신에게 도움이 되는것에만 온신경을 씁니다. 세상을 보는 시선의 폭이 예전 대학생들보다 너무 좁아 보입니다. 경마장의 말처럼 앞가리개를 한 말들 같습니다. 목표를 향해 질주하는 말들이요
그 목표는 취직입니다. 왜 달려야 하는지 왜 이런 경주를 해야하는지에 대한 사회를 향한 비판은 거의 없습니다. 언제부터 저항보단 순응하기 바쁜 모습들입니다. 저항의 20대는 다 사라지고 순응의 20대가 된듯합니다. 몸과 마음이 건강한 20대들이 더 많아지고 세상을 보는 시선이 넓어졌으면 합니다.

3. Rather than observing how this world goes, they prefer instant benefits.

Those in their 20s don’t know how the world goes around. Having English books in their hands, they go to institutes and libraries. There is the minority who participates in society actively and reforms the society. They judge that self-developing is much wiser and they don’t even join clubs. Individualism is getting bigger and they don’t know how to get along. They try to get one more certificates and are busy increasing the score of TOEIC. Those can help them to find jobs. Most of them get obedient in order to adjust to this world that the society already made rather than being against this society. In front, they criticize the government, but they can’t do anything. What they do is they complain about the government in drinking. And when they hear the promises from the GNP, such as about the tuition fee being cut in half and the job positions will be more, they rush to them. But it was shown that the current President is not interested in tuition fees. The young were stroked on the back of their heads. But they supported the GNP in the general election again. Because the Minjudang didn’t provide solutions, as substitute, they seemed to choose the GNP.

When you see those in their 20s now, they look healthy, but their spirits look weak. Whom they support is their choice. So I shouldn’t say too much (If I spoke way too much earlier, please understand). But when I have conversations with those in their 20s, I feel that they’re like children. To parents, 50 year old children will be like children. Maybe my case is like that. But they don’t have any knowledge about humanities and just memorize knowledge of their studies. They just pay attention to things that will help them. Perspectives toward the world are so narrow compared to the college students before. Like horses at horse races, they are like horses having twofold screens. They are horses to run for their goals. And their goals are to have jobs. Why they have to run and why they have to have races… there is no criticism toward society. From some moment, they are busy adjusting rather than resisting. Those in their 20s with resistance are gone and they become those with obedience. I hope that there are healthier people in body and spirit, and their perspectives are getting wider.

His post became the major space where netizens exchange their opinions as follows.

보수기독교의 영향이 굉장히 크다고 봅니다
친구따라 간 교회에서 한나라당찍으라고 피를 토하는 목사님을 보면서 성경을 집어던지고 싶었습니다

I think that conservative Christians affect it a lot. When I went to a church with my friend and saw a pastor who cried out urging the people to vote for the GNP, I wanted to throw my Bible at him.

저도 어제 충격 받았는데요. 낮은 투표율보다 더 충격적이었던것은 한나라당 지지율이 30,40대보다 훨씬 더 높았다는 사실이에요. 님 쓴글처럼 현 세태에 완전 순응하여 일자리에 목매달고 있는 20대들. 하지만 그들이 바라는 일자리가 대규모 토목,건설에서 막노동은 아닐진대….왜 이렇게 허약하게 되었는지 근본 부터 따져봐야 할듯 하네요. 현 정권보다 더 암울한것은 바로 다음세대를 이어갈 20대에 열정이 안보인다는 것. 이 모두 기성세대와 시스템의 잘못이 크긴 하지만 너무 씁슬합니다.

I was also shocked. Of course I was shocked at the low ratio of voting, but that the ratio to support the GNP from those in their 20s is higher than those in their 30s and 40s was more shocking. Like you said, the current generation is obedient and longs for jobs. But what they want is not physical labor at construction and building sites… I would like to know why they got so weak first. What makes me gloomy more than the current government is that it is hard to see passion from those in their 20s. It must be from the fault of the old generation, but I feel bitter.

저도 20대지만…물론 30대에 가까워져 가고는 있으나 글쓴이의 말에 전적으로 동감하는 바입니다… 외국에서 살면서 객관적으로 우리나라의 정치를 바라보고 있자니 객관적으로 바라볼 수 없을 정도로 막가고 있다는 생각이 들더군요… 도대체 무슨 생각으로 투표를 하고 지지를 하는건 지… 답답할 뿐입니다. 저도 20대 초반에는 정치에 관심도 없고 다들 도둑놈들인데 도토리 키재기지… 하는 마음으로 정치에 무관심했었습니다만 이제는 이런 무관심이 내 미래를 그리고 내 후손들의 미래를 망쳐놓을 수도 있겠구나 짧다면 짧고 길다면 긴 5년이겠지만 한 나라의 흥망성쇠가 어떤 지도자를 뽑느냐에 따라 바뀔 수도 있다는 생각을 하니 정말 두려움이 앞섭니다.

I’m also one of those in their 20s. I’m getting old and close to my 30s, but I absolutely agree with the writer. I live in another country and look at the politics in an objective view, it seems the change is beyond the logical degree. In my early 20s, I was not interested in politics at all. I was indifferent to politicians because they all looked like thieves. But this indifference can destroy my future or my descendants’ future. Five years could be short or long, but this period will affect the rise and fall of the country. It scared me.

슬픈 현실
20대들이 하나같이 순응형 인간이 된 이유, 전 알거 같습니다. 아무도 그게 잘못된 것이라고 가르쳐주지 않았으니까요. 집에서도, 학교에서도, 학원에서도, 왜 부자가 되어야 하는지, 왜 법조인이 되어야 하는지, 왜 열심히 공부해서 좋은 직장에 가야 하는지.. 저는 배운 기억이 없습니다. 그저 내가 좋은집, 좋은차, 비싼옷을 사입기 위해서라고.. 막연히 생각했을 뿐입니다.
요즘 학교에 가보세요. 공부 못하면 밥도 정부미로 해주는 판국에 누가 돈과 권력위에 더 나은 무엇이 있는지 배울 수 있겠습니까.. 우리나라..점점 동물의 왕국이 되어가는 거 같아요.
적자생존에 약육강식.. 그나마 동물들은 생존을 위해 싸우죠. 나만 배부르면 다른사람이 굶어도 상관없다는 생각.. 태어나서 말을 알아듣게 되는 그 순간부터 배우는 생활신조입니다.

Sad reality.
I know why those in their 20s become obedient. I understand. Nobody said it was wrong. At house, school, and institutes, I didn’t learn why we have to be rich, why we have to be legal experts, and why we have to find nice companies. We just thought it is for nice house, nice car, and expensive clothes. Go to school now. If you don’t study well, you get worse rice… who can learn there is something more important than money and authority. Our country… it seems to change to the animal kingdom. The survival of the fittest. But animals fight for survival. If my stomach is full, it doesn’t matter whether others are starving… once you learn words after birth, you learn that.

놀라운 자본의 힘이 아닐까요.. 학생운동이 죽은 나라는 더 이상의 발전을 기대하기 어렵죠..

It will be the power of capitalism… the country that dies of students’ demonstrations can’t be easy to develop better.

불쌍하지 않나요 20대. 중 고등학교때 사회를 조금씩 알아가기 시작할때 IMF가 터지데요. 아버지가 부도가 나서 가정이 풍지박살난 친구, 명퇴후 자살하는 사람이 있다는 뉴스들 그렇게 아버지들 어머니들 기운 없는 어깨를 보면서 그렇게 대학생이 되었습니다. 사회가 왜 이런 모습을 갖추었는지는 아무도 알려주지 않았습니다. 단지 아버지 세대의 개인적인 실패를 어떻게 하면 겪지 않는지만 말해주더군요. 어떻게 하면 회사에서 잘려나가지 않고 안정된 회사에 들어갈 수 있는지만 알려주었습니다. 오직 사회에서의 성공이 가장 중요한 것이라고 알려주었습니다. 아버지 세대처럼 능력없으면 안된다. 안정된 직장 보수높은 직업이 최선이라고 그렇게 부모님과 삼사오십대 인생선배님들께 그렇게 배웠습니다.

요즘 사회에 만연한 승자독식주의에 가장 익숙한 세대가 20대 입니다. 그런 풍토를 20대 스스로 만든 것입니까? 20대들은 사회 초년생입니다. 초년생들은 이제 배워가는 단계입니다. 하지만 20대는 그 잘나신 민주화 삼사십대 인생선배님들께 배운 것이 없습니다. 그땐 학생 운동하느라 시험을 보지 않아도 학점이 나왔다는 둥 학점이 안되어도 졸업이 되었다는둥 20대에겐 죄다 헛소리들 입니다. 학점이 안나오고 영어가 안되면 졸업후 바로 낙오자 취급받는것이 20대입니다. 또 그렇게 20대를 낙오자 취급하는건 우리보다 먼저 사회 진출하신 그 잘나신 민주화 삼사십대입니다.

Don’t you feel any pity to those in their 20s? At secondary school, it was the time when they got to know about society. And IMF started. Friends whose families was broken because their fathers are bankrupt.. people who committed suicide after being kicked out. Watching their fathers and mothers who didn’t have any energy, they became college students. Nobody told them why society is like that. Everyone talked about how you can avoid the failure that your fathers went through. How you can’t be kicked out of your companies and how you get into stable companies are what they learned. Success of society is the most significant thing, they learned. You shouldn’t be as incapable as your fathers. Stable companies, high salary jobs… are the best… that’s what they learned from their parents and those in the 30-50s.

Those in their 20s are used to what the winners get more. Who made that trend? Did they make it? They just stepped in society. They’re in the stage for learning. But they didn’t learn anything from those in their 3-40s who are so confident of themselves for democratization.

Those who were busy having demonstrations and didn’t take examinations sometimes. But they could graduate even though they didn’t get all credit. It’s all nonsense. It is those in their 20s who are treated as losers after the graduation if their grade is not good enough and their English is bad. And to treat those in their 20s as losers is what is done by those in their 30-40s who are already veterans in society.

0 comments · »»

China: Fallout from the Free Tibet protests 

a small portrait of this author John Kennedy · 02:42
lingua → mg
sample image for this post

April 15 update:

Harassment of Wang Qianyuan has gone off-line, and in fact precedes this post by several weeks. Also, a friend of Wang's at Duke University has written in directly:

I am a friend of the girl's and I was at the protest. The fenqing are going insane. I am meeting with Duke's president this afternoon, and it looks like the FBI will become involved. Her parent's apartment in Qingdao was attacked with rocks, and they are in hiding (I have confirmed this in direct communication with her mother). This all started on the Duke Chinese Students and Scholars Association website. They started posting “TIBET WAS, IS AND ALWAYS WILL BE CHINA'S” messages a month ago.
[…]
Because all the information about her and her parent's addresses and calls to do violence were posted on the Duke list, it is being considered criminal incitement to violence. What a mess. The saddest thing is that she's a sweet naive kid, and she did nothing but cross over to “enemy lines” and talk to her Tibetan dorm mate, and try to initiate some kind of dialogue…

————
Original post:

While China was subject to ritual humiliation this past week as the Olympic torch was relayed, ignoring the seemingly obvious, through Europe and North America, nationalism quickly boiled over and anyone hoping for an objective discussion on Tibet, even one of the most well-known journalists in the country, is now a race traitor.

So if this week's Free Tibet protests were successful, does that make the silencing of many liberal voices within China acceptable collateral damage?

The human flesh search engines, helped no doubt by the ‘wu mao dang' have gone into serious overdrive; one mainland Chinese woman now studying at Duke University was seen by other overseas Chinese students participating in a Free Tibet protest. What was possibly for her just an attempt to bridge some sort of discussion has led to torrents of horrid abuse and at least one lengthy human flesh search engine witch hunt, on popular forum website Tianya, which began on April 10:

作者:Bejing_2008_ 提交日期:2008-4-10 17:01:00
  
在SF的奥运火炬接力顺利完成的同时,全美各地华人华侨留学生也都给予了北京奥运最热烈的支持,然而在今天的DUKE大学留学生的支持奥运反对藏独的集会游行中,青岛2中毕业的王同学竟然与藏独支持分子同流合污,毅然抛弃事实,站在藏独分子的一边,宣扬西藏人权问题,赤裸裸打着free tibet的旗号,实在给中国人民丢脸,在场的几百留学生都目睹了其罪恶行径.王千源–如果说某些美国人算作无知,那你呢?你这样的崇洋媚外的嘴脸是要永远被中国人民所不耻!

http://www.mitbbs.com/article_t/Carolinas/31158646.html

Author: Beijing_2008

At the same time that the Olympic torch relay was smoothly completed in San Francisco, ethnic Chinese and Chinese overseas students from different places all across America gave the Beijing Olympics their strongest support, and as overseas students at Duke University gathered today for a protest to support the Olympics and oppose Tibetan independence, Qingdao #2 Middle School graduate classmate Wang actually mired herself in with those supporters of Tibetan independence, completely abandoning the truth, and stood on the side of the Free Tibetters, trumpeting Tibetan human rights issues, baldly calling for a free Tibet, effectively embarrassing the Chinese people, with her evil sins witnessed personally by several hundred overseas students at the scene. Wang Qianyuan: if those Americans are just acting out of ignorance, then what about you? That foreign toady face of yours will always be a shameless one to the Chinese people!

http://www.mitbbs.com/article_t/Carolinas/31158646.html

Following that intro are now eleven pages of comments:

作者:zeng_1985 回复日期:2008-4-10 17:59:19 

虽然没看到图,但听说有这种人就愤慨!

Even though I haven't seen the pictures, I resent even hearing about someone like this!

作者:shhbf 回复日期:2008-4-10 18:06:33 

应该全文转。
  
这个家伙,估计是被利益冲昏了头。不晓得他父母亲戚是不是也都转移出国了,也不想想自己的所作所为会影响多少人。

This should be spread around.

This guy, he must be dizzy with confusion. I don't know if his parents and relatives have all emigrated too, but hasn't he thought about just how many people will be affected by his actions?

作者:小杨不不 回复日期:2008-4-10 18:09:04 

上图 啊!

Show us the photos!

作者:iambic 回复日期:2008-4-10 18:10:25 

没什么说的,直接无视了。以后都别让这条狗接近至5米以内

Nothing worth saying, just ignore it. But don't ever let this dog get within five meters of me.

作者:超级实验台 回复日期:2008-4-10 18:14:00 

什么情况?
楼主飞了?
淘点证据出来啊–我去磨刀

What's the deal?
Did the post author take off?
Dig up some proof–I'll start sharpening the knife

作者:iambic 回复日期:2008-4-10 18:17:18 

那个啥,驻美使馆黑名单别忘了再加一个

Why that little….don't forget to add another name to the Chinese embassy's blacklist

作者:药罐子里的椰子 回复日期:2008-4-10 18:24:07 

他可以去死了。不知廉耻的家伙。

He can go die. This impudent guy.

作者:zlyuki 回复日期:2008-4-10 18:25:50 

这个要顶

+1 this

作者:蓝色秋裤 回复日期:2008-4-10 19:04:11 

+1

作者:同样的故事 回复日期:2008-4-10 19:13:48 

天哪
青岛2中的
太丢人了
就地处决吧

Heavens..
Qingdao #2 Middle School
Makes us lose so much face
Shoot her where she stands

作者:超级实验台 回复日期:2008-4-10 19:27:48 

她?

Her?
xin_2106042904172962103411.jpg

作者:推倒推倒 回复日期:2008-4-10 19:37:56 

上去把~
  
我就是要当网络暴民~
  
好好整整这样的人~~

Put the photo up~

I always wanted to be a net-thug~

I'll set her nice and straight~

作者:ntpilgrim 回复日期:2008-4-10 19:40:27 

真的吗,一定要弄清楚。

Really? We need to figure this out.

作者:艹头 回复日期:2008-4-10 19:43:31 

不会吧,楼主要拿出证据说话。

Can't be…if you're going to say this, you need to show some proof.

作者:超级实验台 回复日期:2008-4-10 19:46:33 

楼主人呢?!

Where'd you go?!

作者:durand 回复日期:2008-4-10 19:46:39 

通报国安局、中国大使馆、当地政府

Notify the Ministry of State Security, the Chinese embassy, her local government

作者:二狗和三胖 回复日期:2008-4-10 19:48:31 

拜托,别挟私报复啊,网民不都是瞎子啊

Puhleez, don't bring your personal revenge here, the netizens aren't that blind!

作者:lightscriteria 回复日期:2008-4-10 19:51:30 

一辈子嫁不出去!!!

She'll never get married out now!!!

作者:飘青 回复日期:2008-4-10 19:52:31 

不是吧!!真是青岛的吗?这下厉害找到根,哈哈还是天涯的 搜索引擎厉害啊!!哈哈!!强强!!不知道他家里人知道不,孩子在外面没人管了,会迷路的!

No way!! Is he really from Qingdao? This is way too much, haha, good old Tianya human flesh search engines!! Haha!! Strong strong!! Didn't his parents know their kid would get lost being abroad and nobody looking after him!

作者:wangxiaowenly 回复日期:2008-4-10 19:59:29 

以后可能只有嫁给喇嘛的份了~

She'll only be able to marry one of the Lamaists now~

作者:xuxuming123 回复日期:2008-4-10 20:06:10 

看来也只有婊子喜欢喇嘛了,希望不是她.

Seems that only bitches like Lamas, I hope she's not one.

作者:lawyerhuyue 回复日期:2008-4-10 20:11:27 

召唤人肉引擎!!

Call the human flesh search engines!!

作者:lint金帛 回复日期:2008-4-10 20:15:33 

是不是给洋鬼子日多了?怎么出了这样的垃圾

Maybe she's been fucked by too many foreign devils? Where does such trash come from?

作者:hyngng 回复日期:2008-4-10 20:16:00 

总会有些人头脑不清醒的

There'll always be some people whose minds just aren't clear

作者:yqh1001 回复日期:2008-4-10 20:18:41 

关键要有证据!
不冤枉一个好人,但也绝对不放过一个坏人!

What's important is proof!
We don't want to do any injustice to good people, but if she's bad, we must never let go!

作者:sevenqiqi 回复日期:2008-4-10 20:22:45 

消息确实可靠么?长的还算乖的嘴脸哎。。。

Is this information reliable? She looks obedient enough…

作者:wuhanlsx 回复日期:2008-4-10 20:24:22 

请通知中国海关,如发现她,立刻弊了她,如果她还有家人,请找到她的家人,把这种无耻的子女打死了,免得害了中国人。

Notify China Customs, that if they see her, get her right away, and if she still has family, find them, and beat their shameless children to death, so they don't hurt the Chinese people.

作者:红枫焱 回复日期:2008-4-10 20:27:37 

为她的父母感到悲哀,本来可以引以为傲的孩子成了卖国贼——不知道她想没想过自己的父母在国内会如何抬不起头来
人在做,天在看啊

I feel sorry for her parents, the child they should be feeling proud of turned out to be a traitor—I don't know if she thought about how her parents back home would have to be ashamed because of this

作者:ericxulove 回复日期:2008-4-10 20:33:28 

光说也没什么证据啊,贴出照片来才行啊……
大家冷静,别太过激,没凭没据的,就这么乱喊话也不对~
说不定她是被对她一直有偏见的某些人给利用了,胡乱诽谤,任由网友辱骂她来解气???

You're saying this but you don't have any proof! At least put up a photo, right…?
Everyone calm down, don't be so drastic, there's nothing to base this on, yelling and shouting like this is wrong~
You never know she might be being used by someone with something big against her, slandering her, getting netizens to curse her to vent their anger!!!

作者:同样的故事 回复日期:2008-4-10 20:36:25 

十有八九是真的,
是DUKE的留学生在MITBBS上发的
有代理可以上去看看

It's quite likely true
One overseas student at Duke put it up on the MIT bbs
If you have a proxy you can see it

作者:溢佳颐佳 回复日期:2008-4-10 20:38:24 

如果真是这样
  
就在她家所有亲戚的门口贴上“汉奸”两个字
  
以后对她家亲戚的称呼就是汉奸

If this is for real

I'm going to put the words “race traitor” up on all her relatives' doors

Then her whole family will be called race traitors

作者:红枫焱 回复日期:2008-4-10 20:42:51 

哪位用代理的兄弟姐妹把那个帖子截图发过来好了

Any brothers or sisters with a proxy that can put those photos up here?

作者:红枫焱 回复日期:2008-4-10 20:56:14 

只有头像没有动作比较麻烦啊,这样不能证明她卖国啊,有没有拍到他宣传或者散发传单甚至举旗的镜头?

It's just her head she's not doing anything, that's not cool…this doesn't prove she's a traitor…don't you have any shots of her handing out fliers or raising a flag?

作者:天天坠涯 回复日期:2008-4-10 21:11:34 

她是不是打入敌人内部去了???

Do you think she's gone over to working for the enemy???

作者:巨鸡鸡 回复日期:2008-4-10 21:31:28 

让我日了她

Let me fuck her

作者:clover710 回复日期:2008-4-10 21:33:59 

汉奸!
卖国贼!
天理难容!
迟早全家遭天谴!

Race traitor!
Traitor!
Absolutely unacceptable!
Sooner or later your whole family will have to pay!

作者:四级士官 回复日期:2008-4-10 21:35:20 

贱妇汉奸,民族败类!

Slut race traitor, disgrace to our race!

作者:ggf7522 回复日期:2008-4-10 21:40:29 

不知道她的父母在不在中国,不知道她的父母现在还是不是中国人,如果还是中国人的话明天就应该找个粪坑跳下去淹死得了。

Are her parents still in China? Are her parents still even Chinese? If they're still Chinese, tomorrow I'm going to go jump in a manure pit and drown myself.

作者:我爱瓷器瓷器 回复日期:2008-4-10 22:19:56 

强烈呼吁大家先冷静!!!!
一定先要搞清楚事实,再来批评。如果不是汉奸,平白挂了这个最最可耻的名字,那可是天大的不白之冤哪!
  
就算这人真的这么无耻,大家鄙视她就是了,混绿卡嘛~,中国人这高贵的名号她也不配,我们欢送这样的人入籍美国还来不及呢。

I strongly demand everyone calm down now!!!!
We must first find out the facts, and then criticize. If she's not a race traitor, and we're calling her this most shameless of names for no reason, then what an enormous injustice this will have been!

Say she really is so shameless, then everyone can despise her, let her go for a green card for all we care, she won't be able to live up to the honorable name of a Chinese person, and we aren't able to send people like her off to get American citizenship fast enough.

作者:ccyanlove 回复日期:2008-4-10 22:22:13 

如果是真的,啥也别说了,直接把她灭掉。

If this is true, there's nothing worth say, just take her straight out.

作者:zxmm123456789 回复日期:2008-4-10 22:27:52 

好样的王同学,可惜我在大陆只能精神支持你,

Good classmate Wang, unfortunately I'm on the mainland so I can only support you in spirit.

作者:凌小呆子 回复日期:2008-4-10 22:27:58 

支持什么关你屁事啊!

What bloody business is it of yours to support her!

作者:xiaohuafox 回复日期:2008-4-10 22:30:48 

mit上的确有这个帖子!!
人名没错!

This thread was definitely up on the MIT bbs!!
The name is right!

作者:陈先进 回复日期:2008-4-10 22:51:19 

楼主不是个东西
证据呢?

The author of this is something else
Is there any proof?

作者:不倒霉会死星人 回复日期:2008-4-10 23:13:25 

报国安成不???有没有足够的证据啊????

Has the Ministry of State Security been notified yet??? Is there enough evidence????

The slander, vituperative and death threats continue in blasts, punctuated by the occasional call for proof of her “crime,” until it finally starts to appear toward the end of page two:

wang3.jpg

Followed shortly after by someone claiming to have been at the Duke U protest that day:

作者:antizangdu 回复日期:2008-4-11 6:10:18 

我当时就在现场, 中国学生集会在杜克西校区举行, 总共有400人左右. 藏独本科生们从东校区沿着campus drive 一直跑到西校区, 在这个过程中, 一直有警察护送. 大概有十几个中国学生,学者,穿了”我的中国心”以及”北京奥运”的tshirt,护了一面很大的国旗, 一直跑在藏独的前面一两米处. 他们到了杜克西校区以后, 首先绕场跑了一周, 然后跑上了杜克大学大教堂的台阶上.在这段时间里, 我们一直有红旗围着他们,并问他们有没有去过西藏, 有没有去过中国, 其中大部分藏独都不吭声, 有一个美国小伙说他去过四个月….由于他们事先reserve了教堂前的位置,从晚上7点半到9点, 在他们上了教堂的阶梯以后, 中国学生和学者都在离最下一节台阶两米左右, 国旗在最前面的地方大家一起高唱国歌. 所有在国旗外面的人都是藏独的人. 学校校报的记者在他们身后拍照 照片相当的误导,而且已经刊登在今天校报的头条.

照片..网上的照片太小 http://media.collegepublisher.com/media/paper884/stills/rv87o3×3.jpg
  
这个小丫头就在包围圈的中间, 作出了这样的手势, 后面就有藏独的人在拍照 就是以下这张照片
http://www.mitbbs.com/article2/SanFrancisco/31322350_240.jpg
  
拍照的人就是楼上(雪印轻盈)那张大照片,最右边那面国旗边上蹲下照相的哪个人
  
小丫头真是为了出名,连自己的国家都卖了.
  
我不会贴照片,大家帮个忙 把照片贴上, 留个证据

让中国人闭嘴?

I was there at the scene. Chinese students gathered on the west side of the Duke campus to demonstrate, about 400 people in total. The Free Tibet undergrads ran along Campus Drive from the east side of campus to the west side, escorted by police the whole time. There were a dozen or so Chinese students and academics wearing “My Chinese Heart” and “Beijing Olympics” t-shirts, carrying a huge national flag, running two meters ahead of the Free Tibetters. Once they arrived at the west side of Duke campus, first they did a big loop, then ran up onto the steps of the main Duke hall. During this short time, we kept them surrounded with the red flags, asking them if they'd ever been to Tibet, if they'd ever been to China. Most of the Free Tibetters just kept quiet. One little American guy said he'd been for four months…because they were first to reserve the spot in front of the hall, from 7 that night until 9:30, after they went up on the steps to the hall, the Chinese students and academics stayed just two meters in front of the steps, keeping the national flags at the very front as we sang the national anthem loudly. All the people beyond the flags were Free Tibetters. Reporters from the campus paper were taking photos from behind them, photos which were relatively misleading, but made the cover story of today's campus newspaper.

The photo: the one online is too small: http://media.collegepublisher.com/media/paper884/stills/rv87o3×3.jpg

That little girl just stood in the middle, making this post, and the Free Tibetters behind her kept taking pictures, like this one:
http://www.mitbbs.com/article2/SanFrancisco/31322350_240.jpg

That girl, just to get some attention, was even willing to betray her country

I can't post photos, can everyone help me? Post the photos, show the proof.

Make us Chinese shut up?

Shortly after that comment, someone posted a link to a video from the Duke protest and counter-protest:

作者:心台几点 回复日期:2008-4-11 8:03:07 

大家都看视频
  
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4J6nfyb-3k
5:16开始有王千源,很明显她是站在绝大多数的中国学生的对立面的
视频里有一段讲的挺清楚地
  
7:05的时候,几个同学围着她,质问她为什么打藏 独 旗 ,为什么不打五星红旗
    
7:27 她狡辩说香港也有旗
——————–
  
人肉!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

Everyone watch this video:


Wang Qianyuan comes out at 5:16, and she's clearly standing opposite the vast majority of the Chinese students.

There's one spot in the video that's quite clear

At 7:05, a few classmates surround her, asking why she's calling for Tibetan independence, and not waving the red five-star flag

At 7:27 she retorts by saying that Hong Kong has a flag too.

Flesh engines!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The video above is first posted on page two; the first of several guesses at Wang's US phone number is posted early on page three, and other Chinese Duke students appear to join in there, at which point there's a brief history debate, then after the majority of the language only becomes more violent from there until the end of the thread, which as of posting continues to grow.

Wang's national identity card number and parent's address and phone number back in China are posted on page six, around which time links to even larger spin-off threads begin to appear on the Tianya thread.

wang4.jpg

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