Stories
May 11th, 2008
China: Nationalism vs. nationalism in Korea
· 05:17 · East AsiaIt feels like trampling on an already well-trampled Chinese flag at this point as millions have begun their Olympic host celebrations on the mainland, but carrying on from an earlier post, here is how discussion over the actions of a few Chinese students who resorted to violence as the torch passed through Korea earlier this month looked on popular blogger He Caitou's May 3 post, ‘Nationalism vs. nationalism':
中国留学生在韩国奥运火炬传递过程中殴打了韩国人，原因据说是对方支持雪山狮子旗，而且撕毁了一面中国国旗。当天就有留学生把现场照片发上了网络，当事人迅速被韩国警方逮捕。目前，在韩国的部分中国留学生发出了SOS信号，请求帮助。因为这件事，他们遭到了警方的盘查，受到了韩国狂热民族分子的威胁。也因为这件事，韩国政府表示要在签证政策上更加严厉，危及了所有在韩华人和留学生的切身利益。
昨天晚上，一位大哥在MSN上问我：有没有可能政府出面把那个同学从监狱里弄出来？我说，看看克林顿当年。1993年，15岁的美国学生迈克菲在新加坡因破坏交通指示牌和在二十多辆轿车上喷漆涂鸦，被宣判鞭打6下、监禁4个月。该案在美国掀起轩然大波，当时的美国总统克林顿亲自恳请赦免这名少年。最后鞭刑继续执行，但减至4下。
Last night, one buddy asked me on MSN, is there any chance the government will step in to get that one kid out from prison? I said, look what Clinton did in 1993 when 15 year-old American student Michael Fay was sentenced to six lashes with a cane and four months in prison for stealing road signs and spray-painting graffiti on over twenty cars. This incident created a huge uproar in the US, and Clinton himself requested this youth be pardoned. In the end the caning was carried out, but reduced to four lashes.
新加坡是主权国家，无论是国民还是客人，在它的领土上就必须遵守它的法律。美国是世界第一强国，但是无权更改新加坡的法律。面子可以给，那就是优惠两鞭，但是打还得打，否则新加坡就成为美国的一个州了。韩国也是主权国家，也有法律。客居此地的中国留学生在一次和平活动中出手打人，而且殴打的是本国国民，那么也就必须下狱，接受他个人行为带来的后果。对中国人来说，这种事情不好受。就像孩子在家里没有管教好，出门让外人教训。但是，这也是没有办法的事情。
在韩国，这个问题又要特别一点。韩国人的民族主义倾向在亚洲乃至世界都出了名，而中国又是它的强邻。现在发生这种事情，很难预测事情会朝什么方向发展。在韩国，在日本，突然出现无数面五星红旗，把奥运火炬传递变成了中国人展示本国强大的平台，作为主人怕都会有点想法吧？奥运是全世界的盛会，但是在伦敦和巴黎传递之后，所经之地都变成了红旗的海洋。这种对于火炬的“护卫”，演变成奥运专属中国，怕和奥运的宗旨有违背的地方吧？
Because this was in Korea, this is a bit of a unique problem. Korean nationalism is well-known throughout Asia and even the world, and then you have China, its stronger neighbor. Now that something like this has happened, it's hard to predict which way things will go. In Korea, in Japan, countless numbers of Chinese flags suddenly appeared, turning the Olympic torch relation into a platform for the Chinese people to display the strength of their nation, so of course the hosts would be a bit edgy. The Olympics are an occasion that belong to the world, but after the torch passed through London and Paris, every place it has touched down in thereafter has become a sea of red flags. “Defending” the torch like this makes the Olympics effectively belong to China, and don't you think that violates the goal of the Olympics just a little?
这种情况下，事件升级为暴力冲突，客人殴打主人，韩国人会如何反应？对于打人的留学生，我觉得该怎么处罚就怎么处罚，只要保证他得到了应有的辩护就好了。但是，对于可能出现的针对华人和留学生的压力，政府应该要做应对的预案，以确保他们在韩的财产和人身安全不受侵害，合法权利不受威胁。相信韩国政府也应该明白这一点，在韩国固然有华人，但是韩国人在青岛、北京、上海的人数也不少。
在对伦敦“红衣大侠”暴力行为的一片赞誉声中，大家是不是滑得太远了一点？用拳头做沟通的方式，是不是放诸四海皆准？在这种喧嚣之中，本可以说话的人甚至转变态度去附和，而不是提醒和批评。我觉得这是不正常的，最终的结果还是所有人一起来买单。强大有很多种表现形式，但是弄到鬼憎神厌，鸡犬不宁，周围的邻居都反感，怕不是什么好事。
With all the praise for the “Red Knight's” violent behavior in London, could people be taking this a little too far? Fists as means of communication, does that really work in every situation? Amidst all this noise, people who used to have something to say have now changed tune and are just going with it, and not issuing warnings or criticism. I don't think this is normal. The end result will be that everyone ends up paying the price. Big and strong can be expressed in a number of different ways, but pissing everybody the hell off to the extent of agitating our neighboring countries, I'm afraid isn't such a good thing.
Selected comments on He Caitou's post:
1. 郭巨虾 Says:
05月 3rd, 2008 at 4:16 pm让此事冷下去吧。。再发展起来 对谁都没好处
2. 壹杂志 Says:
05月 3rd, 2008 at 4:22 pm我们总是在自己的出发点很好的时候，做一些结果很坏的事情。其实看看香港的火炬传递过程，我们也许会发现，国内的民族理智进程还有很长的路要走。
3. hehe Says:
05月 3rd, 2008 at 4:38 pm我看＜朝鲜日报＞的社论，针对我外交部发言人的回应，感觉他们有点酸，意思就是＂如果中国留学生在美国、法国打人了，中国外交部肯定不会这样反应＂，另一方面又说要反省＂自己到底做了什么，让中国这样对待自己＂….
呵呵，总之感觉怪怪的，称不上他们有民族主义情绪，反倒像是小老婆被打了，觉得”如果我是大老婆就不会如何如何”，又反思”我是不是做什么对不起老公的事情了…
http://chn.chosun.com/site/data/html_dir/2008/05/01/20080501000016.html
Hah, overall I just strange; it's not so much their nationalist sentiment as it is like the concubine, having just been beaten, saying ‘if I was the main wife, things wouldn't be like this, etc.,' and then wondering, ‘is it because my husband thinks I did something wrong…?'
6. buguanqita Says:
05月 3rd, 2008 at 5:15 pm我觉得，红衣大侠的英勇行为是在向西方人生动地论证“汉人压迫藏人”的观点。
7. 发情期？ Says:
05月 3rd, 2008 at 5:22 pm为什么偏偏在韩国就打人，在美国和日本就未见打人事件呢？这是不是说他们生于淮北则为枳，被那里的人影响了呢？
我就很不明白留哪里不好为什么要留韩国呢？那里有什么好呀？
9. yan50 Says:
05月 3rd, 2008 at 5:54 pm我不极端，但是我还是要说，说到底还是国力不够强大。美军士兵在韩国作奸犯科的不是一次两次了，韩国政府有这么叫嚣过吗？韩国人对于中国人踢了韩国人一脚，美国人强奸韩国妇女的反应似乎不太对称。
欢迎批评指正。
I welcome criticisms and critiques.
10. 管智鹏 Says:
05月 3rd, 2008 at 6:00 pm在韩国，在日本，突然出现无数面五星红旗，把奥运火炬传递变成了中国人展示本国强大的平台，….所经之地都变成了红旗的海洋。……演变成奥运专属中国，怕和奥运的宗旨有违背的地方吧？
博主的话很对。试想如果日本举办奥运，全中国都插上小日本的旗子，国人肯定会有闹事儿的。
The blogger is spot-on. Just think if Japan was hosting the Olympics, and Japanese flags started popping up all over China, without doubt some of us would start rioting.
11. KIA Says:
05月 3rd, 2008 at 6:48 pm国家最多帮他出钱请个律师吧
15. 看不惯 Says:
05月 3rd, 2008 at 7:31 pm我不极端，但是我还是要说，说到底还是国力不够强大。美军士兵在韩国作奸犯科的不是一次两次了，韩国政府有这么叫嚣过吗？韩国人对于中国人踢了韩国人一脚，美国人强奸韩国妇女的反应似乎不太对称。
同意9楼
旁观者的冷静有时候跟冷漠只有一步之遥
我非常能体谅打人者当时的情绪试想,如果大街上有个棒子突然指着你说:你妈不守妇道.
你怎么反应
a.撸袖子干人
b.面带微笑的跟棒子坐下来,摆事实,讲道理,证明你妈其实基本上还是守妇道的
一个正常男人都会选a吧同样,一个把祖国视为母亲,当面对有人抢夺撕毁国旗
你怎么反应…….
I agree with #9
Spectators' silence is only just a step away from apathy.
I can totally forgive those who hit people for their emotions at the time.
Just think, if a gook came up to you on the street and pointed at you and said ‘your mother lacks virtue,' how would you respond?
a) Roll up your sleeves and whack the person;
b) Keep smiling and sit down the gook, explain the facts, apply reasoning, and prove that your mother for the most part still maintains virtue?
A normal man would choose A
Similarly, if you see your country as their mother, and someone grabs your national flag and rips it up right in your face
How would you respond?
……..
16. 和菜头 Says:
05月 3rd, 2008 at 7:38 pm你有本事在韩国驻军的话，你的士兵犯事，一样是在你的军事法庭而非当地刑事或者民事法庭上审理。
此外，不要简单类比。如果2012年，日本举行奥运会。火炬经过中国，满上海街头全是日文人狂舞太阳旗。你上去举旗，要求冲绳和那霸独立，被日本留学生打了一顿，又会怎样？
Furthermore, don't go making such simple analogies. Say it's 2012 and Japan's hosting the Olympics. The torch is passing through China, and the streets are completely filled with Japanese people crazily waving the red sun flag. You go and raise a flag demanding independence for Okinawa and Nawa, and get a beating from Japanese international students, what would you do then?
19. yan50 Says:
05月 3rd, 2008 at 8:15 pm我不是抬杠，你也别生气。我觉得你的类比似乎比我的更简单。
我不是说韩国人处理中国学生有什么不妥之处。我只是想说韩国人觉得中国人对待韩国与对待英美不平等的时候，他们内心就没把自己放在平等的位置上。
我也不赞成暴力行为。你说的伦敦“红衣大侠”，他在喷泉池里打那个ZD分子的时候，我就站在水池边上。我周围有很多中国人大声叫好，我没有，确切的说我很羞愧。但是我理解他们的行为，在那种万人集会的场合，情绪很容易失控，更何况对方的行为也不见得文明到哪里去。我觉得表达方式不同是一件正常的事情，有人本身就脾气暴躁，而有些人则不易激动。所以我不会对他们说你们错了，我只想对他们说以后不论做什么事别那么暴躁。
欢迎批评指正。
I'm not saying there was anything inappropriate in the way the Koreans handled the Chinese students. I just want to say that since the Koreans feel that Chinese people have treated Koreans differently from how they treated the British and the Americans, it's because they don't see themselves as being on equal footing with Britain or America.
I don't condone the violence either. The “Red Knight” you mention, when he was beating the Free Tibetter in the fountain there, I was standing right beside it. There were Chinese people all around me cheering him on, but I didn't, and to be more precise I was quite ashamed. But I can understand their behavior, with the tens of thousands of people gathered there, it's quite easy for emotions to go overboard, not to mention that the other side's behavior wasn't civilized in the least. I think it's normal for there to be differing means of expression, some people just have hot tempers, and others aren't easily agitated. That's why I'm unable to say that they were wrong, but I would like to tell them from now on to not be so hot-headed
I welcome criticisms and critiques.
20. yan50 Says:
05月 3rd, 2008 at 8:29 pm试想,如果大街上有个棒子突然指着你说:你妈不守妇道.
你怎么反应
a.撸袖子干人
b.面带微笑的跟棒子坐下来,摆事实,讲道理,证明你妈其实基本上还是守妇道的
一个正常男人都会选a吧
————————————
15楼的比喻挺黑色幽默的。
当那个ZD站在高处洋洋得意地喊”China lie, people die”的时候，我想在场的所有中国人都憋了一肚子火。“红衣大侠”错在他不是高干，他也敢那么暴躁。
a) Roll up your sleeves and whack the person;
b) Keep smiling and sit down the gook, explain the facts, apply reasoning, and prove that your mother for the most part still maintains virtue?
A normal man would choose A”
#15's metaphor, that's some dark humor.
When I see a Free Tibetter standing above righteously yellying “China lie, people die”, I think that all Chinese people there will be holding back a whole stomachful of fire. The “Red Knight's” mistake is that he's not a high-ranking official, but he still dares show such temper.
21. BlazingCD Says:
05月 3rd, 2008 at 8:53 pm其实，这个事件本身肯定没有问题，抓是绝对应该抓的
但是问题在于，中国人在国外犯事，肯定被抓，没有问题；而老外在中国犯事，无论大小，往往被淡化处理，甚至不处理，还封锁新闻等等，这又是为什么呢？那这样的国家，又值得去爱吗？
Where the problem lies, is that when Chinese people break the law overseas, they get arrested, and that's fine. But when laowais in China break the law, no matter how small or severe it is, it always gets handled discreetly, or not at all, and then the news gets cut or whatever. And why is that? Is a country like this really worth loving?
And the final comment on He Caitou's post at time of posting:
35. Bill Says:
05月 5th, 2008 at 11:05 amDid anybody see the Olympic flag in these 奥运火炬 torch runs ? Is this a torch run about the Olympic Games or about China being the biggest and meanest ?
May 8th, 2008
Malaysia: Vigil for jailed blogger Raja Petra this evening
· 04:13 · East AsiaTake note of what's been happening in Malaysia these past few days since popular blogger and political commentator Raja Petra Kamarudin, 58, was imprisoned on Tuesday after a trial which saw him charged with sedition for having written a blog post.
If the Malaysian government was truly worried about bloggers effecting social unrest, now they have it. Remember, this is a country where any politician worth their mutton—Jeff Ooi was one of several Malaysians who rode their blog and calls for reform to Parliament in recent elections—has a blog, and even the old goats now blog too.
Ex-Prime Minister Mahathir Mohamad has a highly-read blog, as does PM hopeful Anwar Ibrahim.
“They set up their blogs, and they try to close down our blogs.”
Raja is one of the sharpest voices both online and off in Malaysia, so it's highly suggested you check out his statements to the public right after his sentencing, vlogged by Malaysian citizen media stronghold, Malaysiakini.
Raja Petra (or RPK) has had his case brought to parliament, where MP-bloggers are calling RPK's arrest politically-motivated retaliation sought by the current ruling coalition following its heavy losses in recent elections, elections that saw for the first time popular bloggers winning seats, on a platform of increased transparency and post-colonial racial integration.
As the Malaysia Star points out, this is the first time that a blogger has been charged under the Sedition Act, and RPK now faces a fine of up to just over USD 1,500 and/or three years in prison. The trial, which saw businessman Syed Akbar Ali charged with sedition for a comment he left on RPK's blog, appears to have been carried out with no clarification given as to which part of the Act RPK had supposedly violated.
Multi-ethnic reform lobby group Aliran looks at the text of the Sedition Act, and expresses shock that this led to anything more than a defamation charge.
As of Thursday morning, RPK's readers have raised online far more than what he stands to be fined, and also today comes news that Raja Petra is on a hunger strike, and refusing to meet even with his own wife.
Following a candlelight vigil held outside Sungai Buloh prison last night, another vigil will be held at 8pm this evening in downtown Kuala Lumpur.
A Facebook group that has been set up to call for RKP's release is buzzing today, and a whole set of images can be found there, among other places, for anyone who wants to put a badge on their blog to show their
support:
At the center of all this is still the murder of Mongolian former model and polyglot Altantuya; Raja Petra's blog post calling for justice in her death to be resolved has been posted widely in recent days; here's how it begins:
Today, we shall not be talking about politics. We shall also not be talking about race or religion. Today, we shall talk about doing the human thing. Today, let’s discuss how to launch a ‘Justice for Altantuya: restore Malaysia’s dignity’ campaign. And let’s send those bastards who murdered Altantuya to hell where they belong.
An invitation was extended earlier to Mr. Kamarudin to come speak at this year's Global Voices Advocacy summit to be held in Budapest this June, and remains extended now.
3 comments · »»May 6th, 2008
Korea: Chinese students fear for safety after torch relay violence
· 04:59 · East AsiaLast week someone left a comment on a GVO post, something to the effect of ‘the whole world hates the Chinese people now' and for a lot of people in (and outside) China, it sure is looking difficult to even be Chinese these days.
Following the violence in Seoul during the Olympic torch relay there last week, a lot of Chinese fenqing types are for the most part just seeing what they want to see in how their generation and China is now being perceived abroad, and not only on anti-CNN.com.
At least these militant patriotic voices are still getting the most play online. The ‘River Crab Goes Ashore' blogger has been posting recently on the themes of Olympic nationalism and China's image, and on May 2 reposted a piece that has been making the rounds on the internet, apparently written by a female student now in Korea, ‘Chinese exchange students cry foul: The Koreans have gone crazy!' as well as the accompanying YouTube short:
我们是27号当天参加迎接圣火的在韩留学生，我们和所有的中国留学生一样，是为了我们伟大的祖国，为了支持北京奥运而自发的组织前往迎接奥运圣火。然而我们的好意和爱国心被韩国的媒体抹煞，被他们曲解，这几天看到这些主流媒体的报道，我们每个在韩留学生的心都被伤透了，我们坚强的想着我们的祖国，我们的政府一定会还给我们公道。我们看着电视新闻里的报道画面，我们的学生挥舞着国旗，大声的呐喊“中国加油北京加油奥运加油”而播音员的解释却是中国留学生在恶意示威。说是中国大使馆纠集动员留学生示威闹事，甚至还说大使馆一个月前就给留学生准备了棍子等凶器。对，那天是有学生和不良分子起了冲突，但试问，当时的情况下哪个有血有肉的中国人可以视若无睹，圣火传递一路坎坷，出了那么多的事情，我们的学生被打伤，国旗、火炬被抢，如今来到了最后一个资本主义国家韩国，那些不良分子手持凶器就在留学生面前挑衅，而最终这些凶器却被报道成留学生所持有，他们采访不良分子，控诉留学生如何殴打他们，嘴里说着流利的韩语，却硬说自己只是来韩观光客，但韩国人就相信。
韩国网上贴出了留学生联合会干部的照片、学校、学科、年龄甚至手机号码，这些学生会代表的人身安全受到巨大威胁。不光是他们，从昨天周一开始，普通中国留学生们在学校、外面和打工的地方都受到了不同程度的威胁，在我们家附近对我很好的大妈，往常看到我就会亲切的拉着我问东问西，今天我跟她打招呼，她竟然立刻把头偏向一边。我一起住的朋友眼眶泛红的回来，一问才知道，她在回来的地铁上，只是拿着书翻译上课资料的，坐在她旁边的韩国男学生看到她在查中文，立刻就问”너 중국인요?”（你是中国人吗？）朋友问怎么了，他立刻就说“ 중국개새끼（中国狗杂种）”朋友问他”우리 처음 만나서 왜 나쁜 말이 했어요?（我们第一次见为什么要骂人？）”谁知那胖子竟然说 “중국사람이 다 개새기요（中国人全都是狗杂种） “朋友气不过立刻说”너 개새끼잖아（你才是）”，没想到周围的几个韩国人竟然全冲着我朋友围过来，并且七嘴八舌的说“原来就说中国人劣等今天一看果然没素质”，弄得她一个女孩子只能车一停也不管是哪站立刻就跑下车。 这样的事情这两天发生很多，问问周边的朋友，大部分都或多或少的遇到过，现在我们不敢单独出门，不敢太晚回来，一个人时甚至不敢用中文讲电话，我们晚上在外面吃饭时说中文，周围的韩国人竟然几乎都不吃饭拿异样的眼光瞪着我们，就连住在一层楼的韩国大学生都敢占着厕所不给我们用。在韩国两年来，从来没碰到过这样的事情，早就知道看到的都是道貌岸然，但没想到，一夜之间全还原了真面目。想告诉在国内的同胞真相，也感叹国内的朋友竟然大部分都不知道韩国出了这样的事，不知道韩国媒体甚至比CNN的报道更加恶劣，矛头直指驻韩大使馆和中国政府。今天韩国著名的Naver网站上，首页头条就标出他们总理的话：”中国人暴力示威是从侧面损伤韩国人的自尊“同时韩国媒体还指出，韩国民众现在对中国人暴力事件的愤怒没有丝毫减少，要求抓出捣乱分子交由司法处理。天哪，这到底是个什么地方，我们未来的情况到底会怎样，我们不敢跟国内的家人说，怕他们会担心，只有互相安慰互相告诫千万不要单独出门，甚至商量好把手机的快捷键设置成好朋友的电话，万一出事立刻能拨出求救，因为我们连警察也不相信。
请你们给我们加油，给我们支持吧，有祖国和政府在，我们一定什么都不怕，也请你们转告自己在韩国的家人朋友，一定要注意安全啊。
在首尔，27的奥运圣火虽然传递过去了,可是韩国国内却一片对中国的讨伐声.
主要是针对所谓的中国留学生27号的”暴力示威”. 国人都知道,这是夸大其辞的东西. 当然我们的留学生中那天是出现了不够聪明的举动,也许是因为爱国激情的膨胀,有部分学生对ZD分子动了拳头.就是因为这个,给韩国媒体一个盼望已久的反华机会。还有，现场那些ZD分子，自己带来了改锥，扳手，石块等凶器，卻对着镜头说是中国学生袭击他们。最近，韩国新闻中不断播出那些“暴力镜头”和一些所谓的凶器证据，然后说我们的暴力严重影响了韩国国民的爱国自尊心。现在，韩国政府居然要求中国就此道歉。
In Seoul, even though the torch relay finished on the 27th, here all of Korea is still crusading against China.
It's mainly being aimed at Chinese students' so-called “violent demonstrations” on the 27th. We all know this is being exaggerated. Of course we exchange students didn't make the smartest moves that day; maybe because patriotic fervor was surging, some students raised their fists toward the Free Tibetters. It was this that gave Korean media the chance they've long been waiting for, to turn anti-China. Also, the Free Tibetters who were there brought screwdrivers, wrenches, bricks and other weapons with them, then turned to the camera and said it was Chinese students who were attacking them. Recently, Korean news has been repeatedly showing these “violent shots” and so-called proof of weapons, and then saying our violence has seriously impacted the Korean people's patriotic pride. Now, the Korean government has gone so far as to demand China apologize for this.
媒体，政府是一片讨伐的声音，韩国人民当然也对中国人的憎恨到达了极限。他们已经在网上公布了那天带头“闹事”的中国学生的姓名，学校，电话号码等资料。据说，很多中国学生现在手机都不敢开，因为总有人会打恐吓电话，或是乱骂。我们现在晚上都不敢出门，因为很难保证路上遇见韩国人，会挨打什么的。
前一阵子就有韩国学生嘴里喊着“打的就是中国人”而故意把清州一个中国学生给打了。现在27号这么一闹，中国留学生在韩国真是处境太危险了。因为韩国人不像西方人那样，懂得人权，平等什么的，他们其实就是随便动拳头的莽夫。比如，在美国的中国人可以去CNN门口示威，只要有分寸，是合法的，美国人也不能怎么样。可是在韩国，这不可能。他们会野蛮的动用武力。27号，我们学校一个学生只是在ZD份子面前举起了国旗，就被警察当作闹事者制服了。所以，我们在韩国不能像在美国或者别的国家那样自由的争取权利和尊重。
现在，韩国警方已经把几个留学生带走了，好像说要严惩。各个学校的学生会长和一些留学生负责人也遭到人生安全的恐吓。韩国人说要让中国人看看，他们也不是好惹的。还有人悬赏捉住我们带头的那几个留学生。我们只是出来留学的人，平时在韩国受尽他们的鄙视和侮辱不说，就算是支援圣火传递的那一天，表达自己的爱国情绪，到最后都是这样的结果。这么一来，中国学生在韩国，只能越来越危险，越来越没有地位。
Just a while back Korean students kept saying “it's the Chinese who are beating people”, but then went out themselves and beat up one Chinese student in Cheongju. Since the ruckus on the 27th, Chinese exchange students in Korea are in a really dangerous spot. Koreans aren't like Westerners, who understand what human rights and equality, etc. are. Koreans are actually just boors who will strike out at any time. For example, Chinese in the US can go demonstrate at CNN's front door, and as long as it stays within limits it's legal, and Americans can't do anything about it. But in Korea, this would be impossible. They would barbarically turn to violence. On the 27th, one student from our campus only so much as raised a flag in front of one Free Tibetter and was then held down by police, saying s/he was an instigator. This is why we here in Korea can't freely fight for our rights or respect like those in America or other countries.
Now, Korean police have already taken away several exchange students, who it looks like are going to be penalized. Every student society president at every campus and several exchange student organizers have all received threats to their safety. Koreans are saying they're going to show the Chinese people that they are not to be messed around with. Then there are people putting out rewards for whoever catches the few of us who organized this. We're just here as exchange students. Most of the time when we're faced with discrimination and insults from the Koreans, we keep quiet, and now because of that one day we went to show our support for the Sacred Torch Relay, and express our patriotic sentiments, this is how it turns out. If things go on as they are, Chinese students in Korea will only be in more and more danger, with less and less to hold onto.
我是女生，也许还稍微好一点。我想提醒在韩国所有的留学生们，尤其是男生。在晚上或者是中国人少的地方，一定要保护自己的安全，不要随便的和韩国人发生冲突，否则，受伤害的只有我们。韩国的中国大使馆门口现在已经每天都被韩国示威的人们包围了。使馆的人们也很危险。但是，中国一定不能道歉。我们正当爱国，我们没有错，凭什么道歉？？？？大使馆要是不能保护留学生的安全，以后还有谁敢在国外爱国？？？
（PS:今天看到咱们在海外求学的同胞被韩国人打破头的照片，才明白真相，韩国媒体真他妈的比CNN还要CNN！！！那个畜生不如的混蛋不抢我国旗，撕我国旗，我们在海外求学的同胞怎么可能去和他冲突！！靠！！这世界还有没公道！！！）
(PS: Today I saw the pictures of our compatriots studying abroad after having been beaten by the Koreans, and then I understood the truth. Korean media, you're more fracking CNN than CNN itself!!! If those SOB beasts hadn't gone grabbing at our flags, ripping our flags, then our compatriots studying overseas wouldn't have clashed with them!! Frack!! Is there no justice on this earth??!)
——————————————————
在Youtube上引起轰动的一段中国留学生殴打韩国抗议者视频：
发表时间：2008-05-2
本文链接：中国留韩学生喊冤:韩国人疯了！(视频)
关键字：留学生, 韩国, 视频, 殴打
申明：除注明外均为原创,若需转载或引用，请注明来自河蟹上岸和原文链接.
Link to this post: Chinese students in Korea cry foul: The Koreans have gone crazy! (video)
Keywords: Exchange students, Korea, video, beatings
Disclaimer: Aside from stating this to be an original creation, if reposted, please state clearly that it comes from River Crab Goes Shore and link back to the original.
And a portion of the comments on River Crab's post:
1.
yesdo 2008-05-2, 8:28 am
脑残狼孩
2.
sttony 2008-05-2, 9:32 am
如果突然有一天韩国的上万大学生突然在北京示威游行，并且对占少数的中国示威者施加暴力。我们对韩国人的影响将会如何？不过这个假设的前提条件不成立，在北京示威游行是不可能通过“有关部门”批准的。
3.
xxoo 2008-05-2, 9:35 am
难以用语言形容
4.
路过 2008-05-2, 9:36 am
没救了
5.
夜彷徨 2008-05-2, 10:24 am
首先27日在韩国的圣火传递过程 在国内报道了吗
为什么几天后才浮出水面
在终点的宾馆里 确实有国人动手打人 还被人拍下证据了就不要不承认 那是在韩国 有韩国的法规 韩国*文明用语*也要有他自己的威信 不可能欺负到自己头上了还憋屈着
这事闹大了会不会再来个抵制韩国货……PS：韩国的朋友要小心了 注意安全；有国外媒体职责中国没有道歉（不过貌似说要去看望）；韩国好像没有直播那天的圣火传递
媒体都有自己的立场 同一个事实报道不同的侧面而已 不是全世界的电视台都为中国服务 报道些你看不顺眼的就抗议是很不明智的
Why is this coming out only now, several days later?
At the hotel at the end, there were definitely our people hitting others, proof of this was even caught on film so don't bother trying to deny it. This was in Korea, Korea has its own laws. Korea's ‘diplomatic language' also needs to carry authority. You can't go around bullying people then get bent out of shape when it comes to bite you back.
If this gets too big, do you think there'll be a ‘boycott Korea'……?
PS: Korean friends, be careful. Watch your safety. Foreign media are blaming China for not apologizing (though it seems they've said this will be looked into); Korea I think didn't do a live broadcast of that day's torch relay.
Media all have their own positions; one truthful report has different sides to it, that's all. It's not like the whole world's television stations exist to serve China. To protest something just because you don't like the look of it isn't very bright.
6.
警惕 2008-05-2, 10:39 am
你们活该！说什么韩国是资本主义国家，一看就是被洗脑的一群！中国是什么样的国家？自己国家一大堆问题你们敢出来游行吗？跑到别的国家去游行又不知道理性的表达自己的意见，别人发表不同意见，你们像当年的红卫兵一样上去暴打，目无人家的法律，现在尝到滋味了，像文革是一样，无脑子的青年人是被zg利用够了就抛弃的一群，还是去向你们的主子求救吧，看他们会救你们？！
7.
朝南生 2008-05-2, 10:56 am
视频刚开始的部分能够听见一个人理性的声音——不要打人
之后就是一群人在打人后吼出的爱国的声音——道歉
———————————
额滴亲娘啊！那些举着国旗的就是我传说中的同胞吗？
Then as the pack starts hitting people and the ‘love China' voices roar you hear a: 'sorry'
……..
My mother! Are those people waving the national flag my compatriots of legend?
8.
呦 2008-05-2, 11:03 am
楼上说得好！
不知道那些留学生们，有几个是完完全全的评自己的学习成绩出国留学的？！
不知道那些留学生们，有多少父母是官员阶层（以为人民服务的名义敛财阶层）？又有多少父母是富甲一方（官商勾结聚财阶层）？还有多少背后有着丰富着社会背景（狗仗人势阶层）？？
留学生中，有没有父母是贫下中农的？有没有父母是下岗职工的？！哪一个留学生涯，不是靠钱堆砌起来的？！
中国腐败的官员草菅人命的时候，他们怎么没有*文明用语*？城管打死人像打死一条狗一样随意，怎么没有见他们抗议抵制？！！
这些留学生们，倒地是什么样的一群人？？？！！
I just wonder how many of those students were able to go study abroad based totally on their academic achievements!!
I just wonder how many of those students have parents who are high officials (”making” their money in the name of 'serving the people')? And how many of them just have rich parents (the kind rolling in money from government contracts)? And how many of them have stacked social backgrounds (like pitbulls with friends in high places)??
Of these exchange students, how many come from poor farmer families? Do any of them have parents laid-off or unemployed?! Which of these students won't have a career path paved with cash?!
While China's corrupt officials go trampling over lives, where is their “diplomatic language”? The Chengguan beat people to death like they're dogs, and with impunity, so why don't we see them protesting or boycotting then?!!
These overseas students, just what kind of a bunch of people are they???!!
9.
poshi 2008-05-2, 11:22 am
不说谁对谁错了，就觉得那些韩国人变脸怎么这么快，太让人心酸了。
而且…如果说中国人要冷静，那种情况下能冷静吗？那些韩国人直接说你们中国人是杂种，说完了还要说你讲话没素质，如果你是李小龙你把他打扒了还更说不清楚了，人家就说你是暴民。那我们要怎么做？人家指着你的头说你国家的人都是杂种，要怎么冷静？
And…if you say Chinese people need to calm down, can one calm down in conditions like those? Those Koreans said flat-out that we Chinese are inbreds? Once they finish saying that, they say we Chinese don't speak with any civility. Even if you were Bruce Lee and knocked him flat, he'd just say you were a thug. So what are we supposed to do? People point you in the face and say your country's people are inbred, how can anyone stay calm?
10.
poshi 2008-05-2, 11:44 am
楼上有些人显然很冷静呀，觉得爱国就是因为共+产+党吗？那你不爱国你又是什么党？虽然说他们很不冷静，那你又何必这样呢？当事人跟旁观者是不一样的，你别忘了你是旁观者，就算你怎么说他们，你只是一个坐在旁边看热闹的人而已！
11.
死的蚊 2008-05-2, 12:20 pm
韩国人疯了？还是那群“中国留学生”疯了？！！
Coming next, voice-of-a-sensible-part-of-his-generation blogger He Caitou's response to Chinese college students in Korea's cry for help..
77 comments · »»April 23rd, 2008
China: Netizens defend Zimbabwe arms sales
· 07:58 · East Asia , Sub-Saharan AfricaAs the post-election crisis looms in Zimbabwe and Mugabe clings to power, the fate of the vessel holding the latest arms shipment from China remains unclear. Sightings of armed uniformed Chinese soldiers in the country have for some raised the question: how long have they been there and what exactly is their role?
Official statements made by Beijing defend the weapons as merely part of an old contractual agreement, saying the sales don't violate any UN mandates or international laws. Many Chinese netizens are rejecting criticism by accusing America of being an even larger weapons dealer. Reports in recent days have made little mention of Chinese military presence in Zimbabwe, instead focusing heavily on the issue of Chinese arms sales itself; here are the top reader comments on the related news stories from several Chinese BBSes and news portal websites:
霍去病粉丝
这是一个好的开端，不能只准州官放火，不许百姓点灯！！！
jonathanho
美帝国主义是真正操控dl流寇的恐怖集团！！中国要奋起！！！
maozanchao
就算真有巡逻又怎么样？
准你美国佬、英国佬、德国佬在伊拉克巡逻，在阿富汗巡逻，在朝鲜巡逻，在日本巡逻，在全世界巡逻，就不准中国军人在津巴布韦巡逻？真他妈的混帐逻辑！
You Yanks, Limeys and Krauts can go patrol Iraq, Afghanistan, Korea, Japan and the whole world, but Chinese soldiers can't go patrol Zimbabwe? That's really bloody screwy logic!
zslzzll
像中国和津巴布韦的这船武器买卖完全是合法交易，中国没有做错什么。
费舍
强盗逻辑。。。也怪我们做的不够秘密
DanielDiao
卖武器又怎么了，美国大批大批的武器进入台湾也没有人出一声
德国国防军士兵
西方媒体就是喜欢给我们国家扣屎盆子
为什么我们国家的对外宣传这么无力?
Why is our country's external propaganda so powerless?
kenyuan111
我相信政府会妥善解决了，毕竟我们在非洲的影响力是那些西方国家没办法比的！
cbhelp
我们只会讲”我们没错”吗?
什么时候中国能够不以弱者的姿态来回答问题
那就是我们出头的日子了
The day China no longer has to respond as the weaker side
Those will be the days when we stand out
笑你
现在是强者合法的世界，只有在中国打倒了美国后，中国才会有合法的地位，不然的话，在西方政客和煤体中中国永远没有合法过。
GXLS武警老兵
运一点小东西人家就指手画脚，哎，忒没面子啦。没卖给拉登哥和伊拉克反抗组织就不错啦。
GXLS武警老兵
管他呢，他说他的，我卖我的。
网屋大哥
没有做错什么
AKC_113
对!去联合国拍桌子:老子就是要卖军火!能把老子咋的?
中国和津巴布韦的武器买卖完全是合法交易，但是在敏感时期还是多注意些，不要授以人话柄。
这就是帝国主义歧视和攻击我们的证据
不干涉他国内政是中国提出来的，但好像也只有中国一个国家遵守 。世界是干涉的世界。中国的理论很难联系实际，与世界脱轨了。中国应该全球范围内扶植亲中政权和势力，广结盟友。朋友多，路才宽。中国的不干涉他国内政是另种形式的闭关锁国。把自己隔绝世界之外。
17日，南非广播公司、各广播电台、《星报》、《公民报》等各大媒体，均大篇幅报道了“中国军火”抵达南非并准备运往津巴布韦的消息。
On the 17th, the SABC, all radio stations, The Star and The Citizen newspapers and other media all splashed the news that “Chinese Arms” had arrived in South Africa and weren't being allowed to be shipped on to Zimbabwe.
“保利”公司又犯傻了！
南非也开始欺负中国了！！！！！！！！！！！！1
不该卖武器给这些烂人。
中国军火是合法交易!好无疑问,谁阻碍,谁将受到中国的制裁!如果西方国家从中截获,中国也必将以牙还牙!
我们不应该为了这些蝇头小利去损害自己的名声. 出口这些武器的公司实际损害了中国的远大利益.
交易当然合法，就是不太道德，不过话说回来，美国还曾经卖给萨达姆武器呢。
别人的不道德行为是不是可以成为你不道德行为的依据呢？这个问题请同胞们慢慢思考。
Is other people's immoral behavior justification for you to do the same? I'd hope our compatriots would consider this carefully.
这就是西方的媒体，在转移视线。
政府不知道怎么做的，今年老出现重大差错！！？！！抓住把柄了！！！郁闷 ！！！
中国政府一定要保证此批军火顺利到达津巴布韦，否则，以后的正常军火交易将受到沉重打击。
西方反华的贼心不死
西方真恶劣，中国从美国订购两艘航空母舰。
靠,好象美国没卖过军火似的
中国人卖军品就是非法的，而他们卖军品就是合法的，这什么禽兽逻辑？
支持的顶一下！
美国是世界上最大的军火出口国。
强烈支持击沉美国运台湾的军火船只！！！！
简直是污蔑!贩卖军火伤天害理的事情怎么是我们中国政府做的呢？只有美国才做这种事情！！！
反华者无孔不入.
中国出售军火是正常的事情。
美国以后不要卖给台湾武器！
不要总是在外国人对我们采取行动的时候
我们只是口头申辩！！！！
要维护我们自己的利益！
行动起来！
我们需要行动！
When foreigners take actions against us!!!!
We have to defend our own interests!
Spring to action!
We have to act!
美国是世界上最大的军火商.
中国可以对美国的售台武器进行扣留
中国!我们应强硬!应有行动.
没航母真是不行了啊
错在，中国没有航母。
中国是主权国家，中国没有做错什么。
不要把整个自由世界都树作敌人。
象南非这样的三流国家都敢对中国说不那还得了
中国应当向俄罗斯的普京学习。强硬一些。
别人才不敢小瞧咱。
China ought to learn from Putin, and be more tough.
People won't dare messing with us then.
又是CNN
最好能卖点给基地组织,好让他们对付美国和北约.
我看奇怪了。什么事情一到中国人头上，无论对错，全是中国人错了。谁在操弄着世界舆论？谁在折腾中国？！！
只要是支持中国的国家，就多卖武器给他们
世界军火交易市场，美国、英、法各占百分之几？中国才占百分之几？我们既然是世界工厂，现在的比例是完全不正常的，将来应该超越美国才正常嘛！
“中国没有做错什么“ 这句话以后最好不要说了
我倒觉得不该卖给非洲那些动乱或者可能动乱的国家这些武器。难道非洲各种族间打的还不够热闹吗？
不是热爱和平吗？卖杀人武器总是不好的。
你们可以卖,我们就不能卖?你们可以自由卖,我们就应该有限制的卖?这是什么强盗逻辑!你若惹得爷性起,老子明天就扛颗原子弹出去卖,就卖给古巴!我看你咋的!
中国现在卖这种小的军火。以后要卖大的。卖先进的。支持支持支持““““`
强大的中国
Strong China
我估计要是他们卖给津巴布韦武器，中国肯定没得说，那又为什么呢？鬼佬最清楚
应该给他们一个教训，看他们还嚣张！
卖武器赚钱天经地义
有卖原子弹 的吗?我要买 3个;
又是CNN， TM的还在造谣祸众
我靠，大陆现在和台湾是交战状态，谁的船进出台湾，中国也可以要求登船检查。特别是日本鬼子和美国鬼子的。是中国人就顶。
中国急需几个大航母战斗群。
对这种事，更应该强硬。
为什么？因为既然不敢和美英法等发达国家耍横，如果再被此等小国欺负，那尊严就更没有了。
必要时，可以打。
Why? Because since we don't dare stand up to any developed countries like the US, France or England, if any countries of equal or smaller size pick anything with us, we'll lose all respect.
中国需要航母保护自己的利益！
怎么连南非也欺负我们中国啊！我想我们确实需要一场战争来树立大国的威严！！！！
April 18th, 2008
China: One world, one dream, and one multi-front protest
· 22:50 · East Asia , Western EuropeLast week's Olympics “angel” Jin Jing is on the traitor [zh] list now, after she spoke out against the upcoming nation-wide anti-Carrefour [zh] protests set for May 1 [zh].
People can't wait [update: yeah, it's totally on now] to get out to those, it seems, just like Chinese hackers, having already gotten into Carrefour.com.cn, weren't willing to wait until the 19th for the planned CNN.com DDOS attack to begin, all this against the backdrop of millions of netizens finding ways to display their patriotism.
As if that weren't enough, Jack Cafferty's remarks even got the central government on the anti-CNN bandwagon.
So now Saturday is looking like Chinese anti-CNN day in a number of different places [zh] around the world [zh]
At least one related post at China.com has over 27,000 comments over nearly 500 pages. As Heike The Dark Visitor blogger points out, the April 19 protests will mostly be held in western Europe:
1. 1500-1800hrs, 19 April 2008, at the Bundestag, Platz der Republik, Berlin
2. 1300-1500hrs, 19 April 2008, two routes (from Talie – Hotel de Ville – Bastille) or (Republique – Bastille – Hotel de Ville –Bastille, Paris
3. 1100-1500hrs, 19 April 2008, Downing Street outside of Whitehall, England
4. (No time given) 19 April 2008, Amsterdam, HollandThe protests appear to be well organized, with the coordination of donations, banners, flags, T-shirts…etc. While it is of course impossible to tell how widespread the demonstrations will be, an online keyword search, using Chinese, did produce several hundred hits.
One link Heike provides emphasizes that the protesters are furious and promising demonstrations that will flood Europe in a sea of red flags:
On April 18, one of the earlier members of anti-CNN.com posted the address and fax number for CNN's office in Beijing, along with a sample letter for anyone to send:
致美国有线电视新闻网负责人：
美国东部时间4月9日晚6点，贵台主持人Jack Cafferty 在“时事观察室”节目中发表了侮辱全体中国人的种族歧视言论，令人甚感震惊。他说：“他们（中国人）基本上还是五十年来的那群恶棍和暴徒。”
全世界华人充分理解贵国一贯秉持的言论自由原则，并尊重Jack Cafferty的政治立场，但是作为一个公众人物，一个新闻从业者，Jack Cafferty所说的已经完全超越了言论自由的底线，相信任何一个有尊严的华人都不会接受这种对于华人整个族裔的谩骂。
At 6pm EST on the evening of April 9, your network's anchorperson Jack Cafferty, made racist remarks on the program The Situation Room that insulted and shocked the entirety of the Chinese people. He said, “(the Chinese) they're basically the same bunch of goons and thugs they've been for the last 50 years.”
The Chinese people of the world fully understand that your country has always upheld the principle of free speech, and respect Jack Cafferty's political stance, but as a public persona and a news professional, what Jack Cafferty said has gone way beyond the line of freedom of speech, and [we] believe that any respectable Chinese person cannot accept this kind of invective towards the entire Chinese race.
贵台稍候在15日发表的简短声明中辩解称Jack Cafferty所说的恶棍暴徒指的是中国政府，这样避重就轻没有诚意的道歉声明更是令人难以接受。首先，在Jack Cafferty的言论中，他反复多次说到中国，中国人，丝毫没有提到中国政府的地方；再者，Jack Cafferty在说到“恶棍”与“暴徒”时，使用的是复数，其意思非常明确，他口中的“他们”指的就是整个华人族群；最后，贵台的声明把矛头转向中国政府，这样牵强的强辩实际上是对中华民族的二度伤害！难道攻击一个国家的政府就不会伤害该国人民的感情了吗？
为此我致函向CNN以及Jack Cafferty提出严正抗议和谴责！
中国向世界敞开大门只有短短20多年的时间，全世界华人都能够理解各国人民对中国这个遥远的东方国家尚存在许多的疑问及种种误解。但是这并不意味着某些人可以不负责任、口无遮拦地攻击中国以及中华民族。即使不了解中国，任何一个有良知的人也不应该对发生在自己身边的事实选择性失明。
It is for these reasons that I have written to sternly protest and condemn both CNN and Jack Cafferty!
China has only opened its doors to the world for a short twenty-something years, but Chinese people from around the world are all able to see that people from every country around the world still bear many doubts and various sorts of misunderstandings toward China, this country far off in the Orient. But this does not mean that certain people can be irresponsible, and freely make attacks against China and the Chinese people. Even if one doesn't understand China, no conscientious person ought to be selectively blind to facts which lay before them.
以美国为例，华人移民多少年来都是社会中最遵纪守法和最友善的一群人。Cafferty先生是否记得， 9.11事件发生后 ，布什总统向劫机事件中表现英勇的华裔空姐邓月薇家属颁发奖状，称她是“美国的英雄”，事件中另一名中国学生曾喆在世贸大厦现场不停救人最终英勇牺牲，被追赠纽约市“社区贡献奖”的曾喆是美国历史上获此殊荣的第二人；Cafferty先生又是否知道，去年震惊美国震惊世界的弗吉尼亚理工大学枪击案中，有一名华裔女教师挺身而出带领学生顶住大门阻止了枪手进入，从而保护了全班学生。从何时起，善良、本分、为世界和平默默做出贡献的华人竟然成为了Jack Cafferty口中的恶棍和暴徒？
我相信，身为一名资深政治评论员，Jack Cafferty决非无知，他更没有失忆，促使他公开侮辱中国人的根本原因是他对我华人的种族歧视！他的言论无疑是对整个中华民族，尤其是在美华人最无耻的伤害，更造成了非常恶劣的影响，严重损伤了中美两国人民的友谊。
I believe, that as a senior political commentator, Jack Cafferty is in no way ignorant, as much as I don't believe he has amnesia: the underlying reason which led him to publicly insult the Chinese people is his racism towards Chinese people! His words undoubtedly referred to the entire Chinese race, shamelessly hurting in particular those Chinese in America the most, but the most terrible impact this has had is the serious harm it has done to the friendship between the peoples of America and China.
贵台多年来一直标榜CNN在全球树立了很强的公信度和良好的声誉，而现如今Jack Cafferty信口开河恶意攻击中国人的言论无疑是CNN甚至全美传媒界的耻辱！试问一个赤裸裸发表种族歧视言论的人有何资格站在道德高点批评他人为恶棍暴徒？
希望CNN及Jack Cafferty收起傲慢与偏见，立即向全世界华人进行公开、正式的道歉！
如果贵台及Jack Cafferty本人迟迟不愿就辱华言论事件向全世界华人做出诚恳回应，全球华人定将依法提起集体诉讼，追究CNN及Jack Cafferty的诽谤侮辱责任和相关赔偿。
期待你们的答复！
一名普通中国人：
2008年4月18日
I hope CNN and Jack Cafferty retract their arrogance and prejudice, and immediately issue a public and formal apology to the Chinese people of the world!
If this station and Jack Cafferty himself take their time in issuing a sincere response to the Chinese people of the world for this remark incident which has disgraced us Chinese, the Chinese of the world are firmly prepared to adhere to law and file a class-action lawsuit to look into CNN and Jack Cafferty's responsibility and appropriate compensation for this slanderous insult.
I await your response!
April 13th, 2008
East Asia
At Global Voices Advocacy is a translation of Zeng Jinyan's recent letter in which she questions the evidence used in court earlier this month to convict her husband to 3.5 years in prison for his blogging activities.
China: Fallout from the Free Tibet protests
· 02:42 · East AsiaApril 15 update:
Harassment of Wang Qianyuan has gone off-line, and in fact precedes this post by several weeks. Also, a friend of Wang's at Duke University has written in directly:
I am a friend of the girl's and I was at the protest. The fenqing are going insane. I am meeting with Duke's president this afternoon, and it looks like the FBI will become involved. Her parent's apartment in Qingdao was attacked with rocks, and they are in hiding (I have confirmed this in direct communication with her mother). This all started on the Duke Chinese Students and Scholars Association website. They started posting “TIBET WAS, IS AND ALWAYS WILL BE CHINA'S” messages a month ago.
[…]
Because all the information about her and her parent's addresses and calls to do violence were posted on the Duke list, it is being considered criminal incitement to violence. What a mess. The saddest thing is that she's a sweet naive kid, and she did nothing but cross over to “enemy lines” and talk to her Tibetan dorm mate, and try to initiate some kind of dialogue…
R